What does your rank mean to you?

[ifreez]

I have often heard people talk about where they got their rank. For example, to get a black from Saulo Ribeiro, or a brown from Marcelo Garcia, is much more impressive than to get one from Mike Grades, or Phil Salvagy (just example names).

However, even some people on internet forums collaborate and try to propagate that a purple under Bravo, is like a blue in BJJ, (get this) even though 10th Planet purples who *don't* have a 'foundation' (read, gi), win against gi-trained purples in competition.

This proves the whole, "you need to at least start in a gi", to be a booshite argument (the argument that states Prokopos, Bollinger, and Einstein, are good cause they started in the gi.)

Yet, it's like the Tea Party -- a lie makes it all the way around the world, before the truth gets out of bed -- the whole argument that you need a gi to start is pure boochit.

Anyways, test it out, for just as many people who criticize your 10th Planet rank in the BJJ community, the are equal, probably more who envy your rank in the same BJJ community. Those that have a 10th Planet in their city know it's legit because we meet them on the mat in competition. Plus, I have met many in the BJJ community that are very cool with 10th Planet -- rubber guarding and all.

Nonetheless, your rank should only mean something to you and you instructor, how you feel about your game, and how you do on the mat, whether at your school, competition, or visiting other schools, no?. Why should you care about what others think?

Question, does it even matter to you what the BJJ community thinks about 10th Planet JJ? If they don't want to respect your accomplishments, should that even mean shit to you?

[Coringao]

Interesting topic Ian, In my opinion, its all about the fullness of "your" style. I dont teach just BJJ when I teach BJJ, I teach Jiujitsu. So when my guys/and ladies go to compete in BJJ tourneys, I feel that they have an upper hand. Why? Because they are repping Jap jits, BJJ, Sambo, judo, and of course 10th Planet Jiujitsu. Although, I teach seperate classes, most of the time when Im teaching a Nogi class, my students are getting alot more than the standard Nogi class.
I lost my affiliation with my original BJJ instructor, whom I will leave nameless, because I rep 10th Planet. But thankfully, I have great friends within the BJJ community that gladly took me into their association. So, while Im very glad that I reached my Black belt under certian Instructors, and While I hold great respect for them still, they cant make my Jits work, thats up to me.Reaching my Blackbelt in several styles of grappling has only helped my Jits as a whole.
If you get caught up in names, you will forget who you are. The question that you have to ask yourself is are you happy with where you are..in your Jits game.
Coringao

[Dionne Taduran]

I think you're right. I would always wonder at competition time:

1. Why is everyone staring at us?

2. When I mention 10th planet, why do they shrug their shoulders in disgust.

3. Why must they always tell me their own "brilliant" philosophy as to why Rubber Guard doesn't work.


Which brings me to remember...Do I give the slightest shit? No! You're absolutely right, because competition is the one of the greatest tests, whether it be individually, or for a team. No matter what, If you enter the battlefield as your rank, no sandbagging. And you still defeat other competitors of the same "Rank". Shouldn't that justify your rank in the entire BJJ system?
How embarrassing would it be to make a statement like "Oh 10th planet purples are like regular blues." Then they happen to meet one in battle, and end up getting Gogo Plata'd? Would they still think they were a blue? Or would they respect that a person of equal rank bested them in combat?

[Reggie]

Coringo, I see ur from Ball Ground, Ga. I'm in springfield Mo. right now going to a 10th planet school but at the end of the year I plan on moving back to Atl, how far are u from marritte Ga. and do u have a website so I can check out a few of ur classes...

[John Roderick]

Corinago: you sound very influenced by JKD in your philosophies. Well stated and an excellent example of what martial arts SHOULD be about.
1.)-The PERSON makes the rank, or belt, NOT the other way around.
2.) I trainied "no-gi" or Catch Wrestling for almost a decade before training in "BJJ". I was told unless I put a gi on, I wouldn't be ranked accordingly, even though (at a bit older age and with a lot of experience) I was hanging with browns and blacks. Once I put the gi on, maybe two months later I was awarded a blue
3.) IT IS A FALLACY THAT GI MAKES NO GI BETTER. They are separate aspects of the same discipline(s)\
4.) If individuals are overly critical or jealous, then we must be doing something right
5.) See # 3: Nog himself has OPENLY stated that in order to get proficient in no-gi or "MMA Jiu Jitsu" you must "throw away the gi"
6.) any rank promotion is a step on the ladder or on the path. It's a means to an end
7.) rank or promotion (to me) is a personal goal and objective. Being a very goal oriented person, I need to have an objective, otherwise, why bother?
8.) there are "Black Belts" who can't compete well and don't have a good overall knowledge, and there are white belts that are great teachers and practitioners. It's all about the individual
9.) everyone has their day. Some days, I feel awesome, others not so much
It all comes down to the individual and what the instructor believes of them, and they believe of themselves

[Coringao]

Lol, well yes I spent alot of time studying Sifu Lees Tao, and I have always thought that to be the best that you can be as a true Martial Artist, you cant be single minded. So it works for me...

[travis]

My rank means dick. i have the misfortune of being a blue belt for the past eight years. Not being affiliated with anyone, and having a family slow down one's personal quest. However, it doesn't mean that i am going to ever stop doing jiu jitsu. And i flat out don't really care what anyone has to say about the gi vs. no gi arguement, just train man. The proof is in the puddin, puddin. Go and learn and take in what you can.

One of the ups to being a "super" senior blue belt is how surprised white and purple belts are when they realize they have been fooled by that piece of cloth around one's waste. Purple belts, higher ranked purple belts, tend to think there won't be much challenge, and white belts think they have a shot; it is all rather amusing. i just like to train, and i hate to lose. This doesn't necessarily mean that i am going to go nuts in order to win; i'd rather lose and have an excellant match than to win and hurt someone.

Irregardless, whatever the scenario, whatever the philosophy, i take what i can and mentally prepare myself for when i have to practically engage another in some kind of physical altercation...this is the most important point to my rank not counting for dick. Everything i learn, gi, no gi, wrestling, punching, kicking and everything in between is for the one day some stupid ass feels the need to threaten anyone i love; that sir will be a bad day for them.

[Will Thaxton]

would it be a good idea to put your rank on a resume for a job? It would be an accomplishment to me. Something to be proud of. Representing hard work and dedication.

[Coringao]

Actually Will, most applications have a "other interest,hobbies" , and on my resume' I always list that Im an Eagle scout, and hold blackbelts in several styles. It shows that we are hard workers, and finish what we start. Decidated,motivated, and always determined.

[Carlos Rios]

I really like travis' response. and i agree.

However, and this is just my personal opinion, I do care about my rank but in a healthy manner. Heres why.

There are the obvious reasons of wanting to move up in rank such as the fact that its a reassurance that you are not a beginner anymore etc. (though i know you don't NEED reassurance from a colour or belt) BUT to me, its a personal thing. A quest that I began in January when i first walked onto the matts in my schools gym. I find it very fulfilling to learn and develop my technique in my jiu jitsu game (and anything i do really). I'm very proud of being a white belt.. it says i decided to take on the challenge of learning a martial art, and if you REALLY look into it, the words 'martial art' say A LOT. Because it IS an art. an art that takes patience, strength, discipline, intelligence, determination, faith in what you're taught, courage and fucking BALLS.


Now when i get my blue belt, im not gonna lie to you guys, ill be very fuckin happy and proud. TO ME, like i said earlier of it being a personal quest ive taken on, its going to represent that im doing something right... and its being recognized. And no, im not saying i NEED people or anyone to recognize what ive done. As long I know what ive done and how hard ive worked it should be enough, and i agree. However, that doesnt mean that having recognition from others such as team mates friends or what have you is not going to motivate u even further and help you get even further.

So yeah, I do care about rank, but I personally would hate to get promoted for money, or to get promoted when i dont deserve it. I almost look at martial arts like a fuckin cult lol. I respect it, and respect the ones above me. I admire it and admire its creator. I learn from it and want to know ALL of it. :)

[AJ Camacho]

It's a big bullseye on my face that whispers into the ears of heavyweights, "He's done this longer than you, so you should go 100% and crush him."

[Jonathan Wylie]

It means I have a long ways to go.

[bobby rivers]

I have said this before, but since it is a compelling argument I will restate. What was Mohamed Ali's belt? Jordan's? Dan Gable's? They are superlatives to my point. Reaching the top through results and not recognition. If you want to instruct you better get promoted under someone credible or win in competition and beat those who were promoted legitimately. If you can beat them, I'd say mission accomplished.

[Jonathan Wylie]

I have said this before, but since it is a compelling argument I will restate. What was Mohamed Ali's belt? Jordan's? Dan Gable's? They are superlatives to my point. Reaching the top through results and not recognition. If you want to instruct you better get promoted under someone credible or win in competition and beat those who were promoted legitimately. If you can beat them, I'd say mission accomplished.

Word. but I still have a long ways to go.

[bobby rivers]

You and me both brother.

[Jason Eisner]

I have often heard people talk about where they got their rank. For example, to get a black from Saulo Ribeiro, or a brown from Marcelo Garcia, is much more impressive than to get one from Mike Grades, or Phil Salvagy (just example names).

However, even some people on internet forums collaborate and try to propagate that a purple under Bravo, is like a blue in BJJ, (get this) even though 10th Planet purples who *don't* have a 'foundation' (read, gi), win against gi-trained purples in competition.

This proves the whole, "you need to at least start in a gi", to be a booshite argument (the argument that states Prokopos, Bollinger, and Einstein, are good cause they started in the gi.)

Yet, it's like the Tea Party -- a lie makes it all the way around the world, before the truth gets out of bed -- the whole you need a gi to start argument is pure boochit.

Anyways, test it out, for just as many people who criticize your 10th Planet rank in the BJJ community, the are equal, probably more who envy your rank in the same BJJ community. Those that have a 10th Planet in their city know it's legit because we meet them on the mat in competition. Plus, I have met many in the BJJ community that are very cool with 10th Planet -- rubber guarding and all.

Nonetheless, your rank should only mean something to you and you instructor, how you feel about your game, and how you do on the mat, whether at your school, competition, or visiting other schools, no?. Why should you care about what others think?

Question, does it even matter to you what the BJJ community thinks about 10th Planet JJ? If they don't want to respect your accomplishments, should that even mean shit to you?

Ian, I have NEVER heard ANYONE say that a purple belt in the 10th Planet system is a blue anywhere else.
If you did, you can trust that it is simply not true.

I trained in the Gi for four years. It's been another four years since (8 years of training total) and occasionally I'll put on a Gi and train with friends at other schools. There is no reason for this, it's just fun to roll with friends and if they prefer the Gi, I'll look at it as a chance to test myself. Keep in mind that these are guys who train at TOP BJJ SCHOOLS in California. All I can say is BJJ is BJJ, Gi, or No-Gi. Obviously what I am lacking in the Gi are chokes that utilize the Gi, but that isn't my game anyway. It never was, not even when I played in the Gi.

We had a couple guys visit Marcelo Garcia's academy when he was still in Miami. These guys only received a blue belt in the Gi, but were already purple belts in the 10th Planet system. As a show of respect to Marcelo, these guys put on a blue belt to train when in the Gi. Marcelo told them to go put on their purple belts to train. Marcelo and Eddie have mutual respect for each other and Eddie is a black belt under one of the most infamous Jiu Jitsu practitioners of all time. They put on their purple belts to train and had a great time training with Marcelo, who is by the way an amazingly welcoming and talented person. Just FYI...Eddie calls Marcelo the greatest grappler of all time. How is that for a show of respect!

Also, there are many other instructors and other schools that promote students that train 100% No-Gi. The Avellan brothers are a good example of this. They are incredible grapplers, and have a 100% No-Gi program in Florida. David Avellan has had many incredible matches, one being against the great Rener Gracie. Rener wore a Gi to prove a point against David, who wore No-Gi and practices solely No-Gi. The score was 13-7 Avellan. Obviously Rener is a great grappler and a great black belt. I am a big fan of his, but the Gi doesn't make the grapper. The grappler makes the grappler.

You should watch Enrico Cocco. I am a big fan of his game. He went from white belt to black belt all No-Gi and now has his own 100% No-Gi school in Florida. Someone should tell him he's not a REAL black belt. That would be hilarious...especially considering that he submits nearly everyone he faces, gets picked by Brian Cimins to do super fights at Grapplers Quest events, and is a total beast on the mat.

Train a game focused on technique, not strength and size, and evolve. If you get a black belt some day in the 10th Planet system, you can be sure that that shit is as real as it gets.

[Carlos Rios]

the Gi doesn't make the grapper. The grappler makes the grappler.


Yummy. I like that

[Dennis Martinez]

i dont feel rank means anything ive changed instructors 3 times in the last year one cause he wasnt teaching anything the next retired and moved back to brazil and now im with Marcelo but i rep 10th planet as well. Ive beeen a blue belt the last 2 years and have been training 3years total but i tap purple belts and have tapped a few brown belts ( using 10th planet techniques just thought id say that) and in the end it means nothing to anyone but me and thats how i like it. I do jiu jitsu and Martial Arts for my self improvement if i have to sit back and wonder and worry about what people think and say ill sit there forever and be stressed rather then enjoying the fact that what i do who i rep Effects thier lives so much so that they feel the need to Hate look down on and talk poorly about, and in the end still lose to me little old me whos just keeping it real with myself enjoying what i do and living my life one technique at a time.

Life is only about Self improvement and the journey there in....

[WilliamGunter]

when talking mma I think you rank is a snitch, the last thing I want to hear in a venue as I walk out is " he's a blue belt in 10th planet" or whatever. My opposition if he didn't do his home work, doesn't deserve to know what my ground is. Go on the internet spy on the gym whatever, I'm not gonna give you the info though, ya know? grappling comps totally different. I will say though I'm proud to be a part of 10th planet, and do look forward to moving up in rank. but when I sign up for fights it'll say Anu academy for ground. and thats it! lol

[Jonathan Wylie]

Ian, I have NEVER heard ANYONE say that a purple belt in the 10th Planet system is a blue anywhere else.
If you did, you can trust that it is simply not true.

I trained in the Gi for four years. It's been another four years since (8 years of training total) and occasionally I'll put on a Gi and train with friends at other schools. There is no reason for this, it's just fun to roll with friends and if they prefer the Gi, I'll look at it as a chance to test myself. Keep in mind that these are guys who train at TOP BJJ SCHOOLS in California. All I can say is BJJ is BJJ, Gi, or No-Gi. Obviously what I am lacking in the Gi are chokes that utilize the Gi, but that isn't my game anyway. It never was, not even when I played in the Gi.

We had a couple guys visit Marcelo Garcia's academy when he was still in Miami. These guys only received a blue belt in the Gi, but were already purple belts in the 10th Planet system. As a show of respect to Marcelo, these guys put on a blue belt to train when in the Gi. Marcelo told them to go put on their purple belts to train. Marcelo and Eddie have mutual respect for each other and Eddie is a black belt under one of the most infamous Jiu Jitsu practitioners of all time. They put on their purple belts to train and had a great time training with Marcelo, who is by the way an amazingly welcoming and talented person. Just FYI...Eddie calls Marcelo the greatest grappler of all time. How is that for a show of respect!

Also, there are many other instructors and other schools that promote students that train 100% No-Gi. The Avellan brothers are a good example of this. They are incredible grapplers, and have a 100% No-Gi program in Florida. David Avellan has had many incredible matches, one being against the great Rener Gracie. Rener wore a Gi to prove a point against David, who wore No-Gi and practices solely No-Gi. The score was 13-7 Avellan. Obviously Rener is a great grappler and a great black belt. I am a big fan of his, but the Gi doesn't make the grapper. The grappler makes the grappler.

You should watch Enrico Cocco. I am a big fan of his game. He went from white belt to black belt all No-Gi and now has his own 100% No-Gi school in Florida. Someone should tell him he's not a REAL black belt. That would be hilarious...especially considering that he submits nearly everyone he faces, gets picked by Brian Cimins to do super fights at Grapplers Quest events, and is a total beast on the mat.

Train a game focused on technique, not strength and size, and evolve. If you get a black belt some day in the 10th Planet system, you can be sure that that shit is as real as it gets.

Thats good stuff Jason.
Ive heard that Jake Shield has only trained no gi does anybody know if there is any truth to this.

[Tim Elliott]

This grading thing is foreign to me. Iv studied Muay Thai for years. I have always been critical of gyms that introduce grading systems. The great practitioners are not graded, so how do you justify grading people? A bit like what was said about Mohamed Ali.

Having said that, if you look at Muay Thai, once it makes its way to the west, you have no idea what people know, who they have fought etc. Did someone fight bone hard Thais who went pro at 6 years old, or is it all sex tourist fights against skinny amateurs paid to take a beating. You just cant know, and so its so hard to know if what your being taught is legit. I dont know how many times I have seen someone who has been taught utter bullshit get into the ring and get destroyed in a Kickboxing fight.

In Jiu Jitsu they would have had a way of telling whether or not this gym was just a random guy, making stuff up. Theres a lineage and people are accountable. I dont know about other countries but in NZ these gyms are common. Iv seen a BJJ whitebelt obliterate a black belt from a local "street jiu jitsu" gym on the ground in an MMA fight.

I dont need a belt to fight with confidence, but I would definitely like one to teach with confidence. Theres a big difference between putting your self on the line and putting someone else out there based on your knowledge, and having that knowledge judged by a master is a great thing.

[Joe O'Laughlin]

I think its more about having a goal to strive for . To belive in something whole heartedly and knowing it has a chance for advancement. Ive been doing jj for 5 years and mma training for 8 . Im not ranked by anyone but Im a surpise to anyone who thinks to highly of themselves . Id definelty like to have a badge of honor showing the hard work ive put in .For me ! ! for my mindset . has nothing to do with anyone else , cause the only others that matter your teammates know how good you are already .

Another factor is with 1oth planet just breaking out of its shell and becoming more respected. Im hoping to get affiliated one day after proving myself or getting one closer to my hometown. closest affiliate is 3hrs away one way. 4hours away another , or miltiech non 10th planet . or My own gym which we train.at ......... . Eddie hit up the midwest theres some resources out here lol... We have way to much training time and 10planets videos to watch , Cant wait for the moons to take over everything then they can blame someone else ..

[ifreez]

Like I've said, for me a belt is a relationship between me an my instructor. For me it's simple, and for no other reason than I know where I am because my instructors vast experience qualifies him/her to critique my game. And I expect him/her to be honest!

That's what the belt system is for me. It's not for me to brag at a bar, at a dinner table of in-laws, or to walk into another school, or a grappling event, and have people ooh and ah.

If you meet people who treat your belt, or that you train no-gi, with disdain, ignore them and just do your thing.
If your instructor has years of experience, he knows where you are and should answer to no-one, and that should be all that matters.

My point is that if your belt's worth is for others to measure, then you don't train for the right reason. For example, in BJJ, it's very common that I see someone (person-A) mad because someone else at their academy get a belt that person-A feels Person-B doesn't deserve, and all person-A can think about is that this possibly diminishes the value of his/her belt. Those cats are nothing but fragile egos to me. Or some people believe training under a world champion is better than training under a great teacher. Why is that?

And, yes, there has been tremendous criticism of 10th Planet on various MMA boards. Here is one of many crescendos, culminating from years of tension between 10th planet and the BJJ/MMA community.

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum.posts&forum=1&thread=1600097&page=1

[michael craig]

im going to go burn my bely right now and be a 10th planet ronin...wandering the jiu-jitsu wateland fighting evil

[Tim Elliott]

I told the guy who teaches me Muay Thai about how Eddie will grade you from afar. Now, I have never heard him say anything nice about belt systems. He has a Blackbelt in TKD and I think it left a sour taste in his mouth. When we lost BJJ from our gym and I said something about grading his reply was "fuck grading".

When I called him and told him it appeared if we put the work in with the 10th Planet stuff we could be graded by Eddie Bravo and get belts he went "really? fuck yeah, I want to do that".

So some people clearly put a much higher value on them.

[michael craig]

some people just want the blackbelt whether they earn it or not its something to just have

[John Roderick]

Jason Eisner, you are wise beyond your years. I couldn't have stated it better. If you're legit, you're legit. Jiu Jitsu is jiu jitsu.

[Neale Hoerle]

Personal growth is the most important aspect overall. While I can agree that grading or ranking is essential for reasons of heirarchy and Teaching I believe it is equally important to grow day by day. Eddie recognizes this and it is apparent in all of the coaches he chooses for his system. See yourself as a student of the system, not a belt. I see personal growth in myself, my 10TH Planet Family, and my students every day. As for our Purple being equalivalent to a blue anywhere else... I'd say thats a bit skewed... We have the best system bar-none guys.

Believe

[ifreez]

Thats good stuff Jason.
Ive heard that Jake Shield has only trained no gi does anybody know if there is any truth to this.

Yes, taken from his twitter, he said he has only trained in the gi for 4 hours of his life.

[Kevin Green]

Ive been training and fighting since 91. Traveld and trained with alot of different people at alot of different schools (Military Life) and feel like Ive gotten a wealth on knowledge from a variety of great fighters (which is another topic all together - better to have a variety or stick with the same instructor??). I Had a fight team in AZ and finally (in 2006) moved to DE when I got out of the Military. It was my first opportunity to settle in one place and take a formal class and try to stick with one instructor. It was a Gi school. The guy was a Black Belt under a student of Rickson (Luis Something). Anyway. Day one of class (remember I'd been training for about 15 years at this point) the guy didnt respect any of what Ive accomplished or learned or the time I put in and he gave me a white belt :) Im not into that at all, just wanted to train and learn some new stuff. So, I put it on. I smashed him, his purple blue and brown belts. Needless to say, after being there for 3 moths or so he started promoting me very quickly (which ment nothing to me at this place seeing that he hadnt taught me a thing). Long story short, I opened my own place (I hate the Gi)and several of his instructors and many of his students left to train with me.

My view, the belt shows the time someone has put into the art...and I have respect for anyone who dedicates that much time to this sport or any sport for that matter. But dont lose sight of the fact that there are many people who have lots and lots of time in this sprot and art and have taken an unconventional path....dont discredit their mat time and their hard work over the belt they wear.

[John Roderick]

Jake Shields is only No-Gi and is a BB, and much of the BJJ "traditionalists" are recognizing the need to note skill whether in the gi or not. If you are good, you are good. To me, the argument that gi makes no gi better is nonsense and moot. I've seen some other forum/facebook quotes about it and it's just brainwashing. I trained in gi for about a year or so, not including my formative years, and it's all the same. I just think my techniques will work better with more friction and if I have more to grab. I guarantee you won't break this former mason's grip :)

[John Roderick]

EXTREMELY WELL STATED KEVIN!! Excellent point of view, and 100% spot on.

[Kevin Green]

EXTREMELY WELL STATED KEVIN!! Excellent point of view, and 100% spot on.

Thanks John....you trained with me...you know what I am saying :)

[Neale Hoerle]

Amen Kevin...

[John Roderick]

So I guess the real point of all this is just to say-the rank doesn't mean anything. Let's just go out and choke some fuckers! (Paraphrased from Kevin). :)

[Jay Chow]

In one sentence: John Roderick is right.

Rank means a lot to some people, and being a blue belt going over to LA to get my purple, it meant a lot to me to. Not getting it killed me at first, but I am now feeling better than ever, really enjoying my Jiu Jitsu, and not having any stress or expectations when I roll. I am a blue belt, and I'm damn proud to be a blue belt. It doesn't matter who I tap, what rank I tap, or how many I tap; all that matters to me now is doing well in competitions and beating guys.

Yes, a purple belt is more "respected" than a white or a blue belt, but my new goal is becoming a better, wiser grappler than I ever thought imagineable, and that means more to me now than changing the color of my belt.

Not getting my purple was the best thing possible for me to become a better grappler.

[Dennis Martinez]

Personal growth is the most important aspect overall. While I can agree that grading or ranking is essential for reasons of heirarchy and Teaching I believe it is equally important to grow day by day. Eddie recognizes this and it is apparent in all of the coaches he chooses for his system. See yourself as a student of the system, not a belt. I see personal growth in myself, my 10TH Planet Family, and my students every day. As for our Purple being equalivalent to a blue anywhere else... I'd say thats a bit skewed... We have the best system bar-none guys.

Believe



Believe is RIGHT...

[Kevin Green]

So I guess the real point of all this is just to say-the rank doesn't mean anything. Let's just go out and choke some fuckers! (Paraphrased from Kevin). :)

Rank represents the time you've put in and time in is VERY inportant. But others have just as much time (if not more) despite what they wear. Im just saying dont judge a book by its cover because not everyone chooses the same path..but yes, lets choke some fuckers :) AGREE

[Jay Chow]

rank represents the time you've put in and time in is very inportant.

qft^

[Gerad]

old school belief, a belt holds up your pants... Belt grades matter within a school to help students within that school know where eachother is at in training. More or less. Americans like to think belts matter, just like trophies. Really, the martial arts is a personal mission that apply to the student alone. Competition is based on belt color, as an American and somewhat modern method of creating an even playing field. The Martial Arts is a combative system, the best should win without regards to rank. Reputation should and often does matter significantly more than a belt color.

[Jim Allen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaq72-rAqJU

I think Miyagi makes a valid point here which applies to any martial art...

[Jeff Doherty]

It's been said a lot already, but belts don't mean much although sometimes it's nice to have reassurance that your accomplishments don't go unnoticed. You make your own rank based on skill.

[ifreez]

I think belts are a measure of where you are, although many instructors do it differently.

So, yes, I fully believe progress can be measured.

For example, I've heard Leo Vieira say that you get you blue, when you start doing Jiu Jitsu, and applying technique (rather than just wrestling and spazzing out, like most beginners who don't have a clue about what they are supposed to be doing).

You get your purple when you're no longer confused (as in, no more "oh, shit, what do I do from here again?"), but you know your way around the mat very well. And you get your brown when you are a stud at your game, and have very accurate answers from anywhere -- you're 'vocabulary' is sound. Finally, you get your black when you have the maturity to wear one.

Another BB once told me, he gives his blacks when a student's body just does 'Jiu Jitsu' naturally without thinking (paraphrase).

However, my point was that this is a relationship between you and your instructor, and no one else. Too many people are caught up in the, 'where you got your belt' argument. Or the 'what does my belt mean in the broader community?' argument. My opinion is that when you start stressing over what your belts means to others, you've lost an important character trait.

It is important to have rankings that aren't laughed at, of course. But, it is beyond sensible to start that whole, 'a brown at your school is like a blue at mine' argument.

[Dustin C.]

the guy didnt respect any of what Ive accomplished or learned or the time I put in and he gave me a white belt :) Im not into that at all, just wanted to train and learn some new stuff. So, I put it on. I smashed him, his purple blue and brown belts.

My view, the belt shows the time someone has put into the art...and I have respect for anyone who dedicates that much time to this sport or any sport for that matter. But dont lose sight of the fact that there are many people who have lots and lots of time in this sprot and art and have taken an unconventional path....dont discredit their mat time and their hard work over the belt they wear.

^^ this