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View Full Version : Massive trouble from mount to standard armbar



Clinton lawrence
01-31-2011, 04:57 AM
i dont know what i'm doing wrong but i cant seem to get any love from the standard arm bar from mount in reguards to the fact i either land with my arse to far away from his shoulder so i have to shuffle up and if the guy is quicker them me he escapes or i cant seem to balance myself long enough to bring my leg all around the guys head as i'm spinning any tips or advise would be great cheers

Will Thaxton
01-31-2011, 05:13 AM
I would say try just securing deep hook and transition to spiderweb. Then go from there.

Bill Keeling
01-31-2011, 05:21 AM
This is actually a common problem. let me try to give you step by step.
1. let's say they push up on you and give you the opp. and you attack their left arm.
2. first place both hands on their chest, one of your arms going over the arm your attacking, and the other one under.
3. lean forward a little so that your weight is slightly on your opp chest, then swing your leg around (keeping tight). This is a drill to help you feel the mechanics. drill each side 10 times, then you will start to get it down. Then you can start adding details that increase your pecentages. (ie; turning their head away as you transition, locking your feet under the opposite shoulder, etc...)
Feel free to hit me up anytime!

Jay Chow
01-31-2011, 05:31 AM
Are you going to S-Mount first? This is important. Grab the shoulder, go to S-Mount, keep your knees pinched tight, grab the leg, and swing the leg around when you fall back

Bill Keeling
01-31-2011, 05:43 AM
JC, actually you should trans the leg before you fall back, as it keeps it tighter, and prevents the escape, thereby increasing your percentages. But the q pertained to standard mount. S-mount is the next progression :)

Clinton lawrence
01-31-2011, 05:48 AM
jay chow standard mount son i aint no blue belt yet sir tsk s mounting me :)

Scott Philips
01-31-2011, 09:15 AM
I'm no "blue belt" either but if I want to increase my armbar percentages from mount I transition to s-mount as well. Either s-mount or bait a bustamonte (swim move from a bridge mount escape).

bobby rivers
01-31-2011, 09:39 AM
Standard mount armbar is low percentage and prob why your having problems. Your square with them. You have to trap them first, s-mount. Its all about the gansta lean mount principle and angles, just like most attacks.

It's not all one motion and it starts by beating his elbow with your knee(there are lots of trix for this). Then drive that knee up past his head and his elbow is between your hips. You should be almost 90% and controlling the far arm. Then s-mount(bow tie) to spider web.

If someone told you this is to advanced to learn they lied. If you dont think your ready to learn it your wrong. This is just my opinion. good luck.

leach_jeffrey
01-31-2011, 09:44 AM
S-mount will certainly make this easier for you. It's not an 'advanced' thing.

Also, always get the legs in position before you fall back. If you fall back before you've swung the leg over, they'll escape on you much more often. If you have a good S-mount, you won't need to rush.

Here is a link to a video that shows the s-mount. I almost gave up on this video because I didn't like they way he explained it until he gave the 'modification' at 1:50. I'd say that the modification is the way you'd want to do it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVK_0ZoLEO0

AJ Camacho
01-31-2011, 11:59 AM
In my opinion the standard mounted arm bar, at lower levels, is an explosive move that must be done faster than your opponent can pull his elbow in. This is because at lower levels, people lack the technique to keep their body tight enough to trap their opponent's tricep, so execution relies on speed. As you get better in live rolling, you'll notice that you actually perform the move slower but tighter, which naturally develops into an S-mount control position before hitting the arm bar.

There's a reason why the mounted arm bar is a "basic" move and it's not because it's easy. It's basic because it contains multiple mechanics (timing, trapping the arm, pivoting off their chest, securing the arm bar position) that will take forever to master. De-constructing the move into multiple steps and analyzing it will yield key observations such as learning to control and isolate the shoulder during the transition, how to pin them during the rotation, and why a deep arm hook works better than a simple elbow trap (when fighting an opponent who knows how to defend properly)... etc.

So try slowing it down when you drill it and feel out each mechanic. Understand the S-Mount, because you are passing through it anyways even though you don't know it.

Scott Yockel
01-31-2011, 12:26 PM
Hit spider web from s-mount. All these guys have it right. More control is always better. Thats like tryin to do a flying armbar without clinching first.

Peter Hirt
01-31-2011, 12:29 PM
The best tip I've picked up was from a Bas Rutten DVD actually. I was having what seemed to be a similar issue -either letting my opponents escape during the transition, or flat moving myself into the wrong spot. The solution for me was to trap their arm first in an almost Kimura like lock. There's absolutely NO pressure or threat of a Kimura - but it locks up their arm and gets their bicep and even arm pit sometimes pinned against my body so deeply, that I can take my time going through the transition and still hit it. I'm noticing that if I use my legs right and squeeze everything together during the transition, they can't really even hold onto their own hand for defense.

From mount, I attack their right arm by grabbing their right wrist with my left hand from above. With their elbows in and their hands up, I come down from above their shoulder with my left, my left elbow still up by their ear -almost like I'm trying to use their own arm for leverage in a "forearm in their throat" kind of thing. Then I slide my right hand like a knife under their elbow and grab my own left wrist. I stay leaning into the whole thing, and pull them up and in as tightly as possible. As you transition into the arm bar at this point, you may feel a little akward because your left hand is on their wrist upside down from the standard arm bar leverage grab, but that's part of what helps set the whole thing up from the beginning.

Of course, for full disclosure: I wear a Gi - but I think it only becomes an advantage to my opponent in their defensive options. I ignore the Gi's when I try this technique. I am also a medium sized fish in a very small pond; perhaps others with more experience will steer you in better directions!

Cookie Monster
01-31-2011, 02:41 PM
in the mount when they t rex like hell
grab the top of your opponents head and crawl your knees up to high mount
and your opponents arms (both or maybe just one) will be isolated from there take your sweet ass time to
go into spider web etc

you can somtimes put both arms on his wrist (careful cause you could get bumped off)
force it to the mat and than start your crawl to high mount

arm isolation! thats the key!

Jason Hyatt
01-31-2011, 03:27 PM
Are you going to S-Mount first? This is important. Grab the shoulder, go to S-Mount, keep your knees pinched tight, grab the leg, and swing the leg around when you fall back

+1

Ehsan_Karam
01-31-2011, 04:28 PM
-Lean your weight forward at a 45 degree angle (your right if attacking his right arm and vice versa)
-connect your hip behind the guy's tricep to prevent him pulling out
-sit ON his shoulder THEN slide your butt down to the mat
-keep him tight with your heels
(not a step by step but details that will raise your percentages)

Ehsan_Karam
01-31-2011, 04:29 PM
^^^Standard arm bar NOT s-mount variation

Patrick Carey
01-31-2011, 07:11 PM
in the mount when they t rex like hell
grab the top of your opponents head and crawl your knees up to high mount
and your opponents arms (both or maybe just one) will be isolated from there take your sweet ass time to
go into spider web etc

you can somtimes put both arms on his wrist (careful cause you could get bumped off)
force it to the mat and than start your crawl to high mount

arm isolation! thats the key!

if they are "t-rex like hell" then you won't be able to get your elbows up into their armpit.

bobby rivers
01-31-2011, 09:02 PM
Then you jam the tip of your elbow in his throat and see if he still t-rex's.

Harry Evans
02-01-2011, 03:29 PM
I am tall and lanky, and had the same issue for awhile, but I have been working my S-Mount and just won my 2nd and 3rd fights on Saturday with armbars from mount. It's not just that it makes the transition tighter. It's that it can be really hard to keep your weight on someone in mount in general if you have my build, and it's easy to defend an armbar if you have no weight on you. S-Mount makes it feel like you can't breath or move, and helps the top guy's knees trap the arm/shoulder of the guy on his back. the further you twist into S-Mount, the more you feel like you already have the armbar, and you can keep the transition tight by pressuring the back of his tricep with your chest when you are that high up on him. Good luck, mount is really tough, at least for me.

Harry Evans
02-01-2011, 03:32 PM
Sorry, missed the "NOT S-Mount" comment. But if you think about it, there is not much difference, except you just don't chill in the intermediate position. My instructor showed me that turning the leg that will not be going over his face helps you rotate and keep weight on him, especially if you are lanky. Whether you choose to stop in S Mount or just grab an armbar is up to you

Nabil Salameh
02-01-2011, 06:25 PM
My #1 way to hit armbars from mount is S-mount for sure. If you wanna get those armbars from another way, just get a super high mount then fish for the deep hook and go form there. But If your that high already, might as well just hit S-mount :)

travis
02-02-2011, 08:47 PM
Place both hands on your opponents chest, and in one rapid succession of movements, pick up your hips, swing them and your legs around one of your opponents arms, slide down your opponent's arm like a fire pole keeping pressure on the tricep, place back of one of your knee's against opponent's face, bring heels in, wrap opponent's arm with both of your hands/arms, squeeze knees, lean back, slowly raise hips, thumb up, pull on sleeve of gi if necessary; if you can do all that, your armbars will be solid...right Renato?

Tom Van
02-03-2011, 12:25 AM
Dude, your problem is you're not wearing the gi. Put that shit on, and you'll be straight.

Jonathan Wylie
02-03-2011, 03:42 AM
This is actually a common problem. let me try to give you step by step.
1. let's say they push up on you and give you the opp. and you attack their left arm.
2. first place both hands on their chest, one of your arms going over the arm your attacking, and the other one under.
3. lean forward a little so that your weight is slightly on your opp chest, then swing your leg around (keeping tight). This is a drill to help you feel the mechanics. drill each side 10 times, then you will start to get it down. Then you can start adding details that increase your pecentages. (ie; turning their head away as you transition, locking your feet under the opposite shoulder, etc...)
Feel free to hit me up anytime!

This is how I was taught the standard armbar from mount with one key exception instead of just swingning your leg around, say you'r attacking your oponets right arm you slide your left knee up next to his head as if you were moving into s mount but leave your right foot flat on the floor leaning forward the whole time keeping pressure on your opponets chest with your hands keeping him flat, thats the first position. Then keeping your hips low and your weight forward you step over with your left foot and slide down his arm to the floor at this point you have to hook the arm either traditional with your right arm or 10th planet style with your left arm and finish the arm bar. The problem is if you fail to keep your opponet flat on his back you could loose position and would need to go ahead and transition to s mount and the set up only really works if your opponet extends his arm as if to push you off.

Josh Passini
02-03-2011, 12:09 PM
I always use Eddie's head and armpit control in mount and use it to transition to s mount then to spiderweb. Remember the deep hook at all times. Keep repping it shit will click.

bobby rivers
02-03-2011, 12:16 PM
^ I also love this setup.

Brandon Mccaghren
02-03-2011, 01:15 PM
i think if you are "looking" for the armbar that may be the first error.

if you want to do the traditional armbar (the basic swing your legs over style), you have to wait for the moment when your opponent gives it to you. don't force it. he needs to be pushing pretty hard against your chest, and you need to have a lot of reps in on this particular style of armbar (just like any other tech). the first 2 submissions i ever got in competition were both with this armbar.

the problem is that as people get better, they stop pushing up on your chest and they start hiding their arms better. not to mention the fact that they are no longer laying on the bottom waiting to get submitted. they are escaping before you even get set into position if they know what they're doing.

now you gotta open him up. you gotta have great weight distribution. you have to threaten him in order to get him to expose a limb or his neck.

i like the s-mount, but the problem of fighting the t-rex still exists. without the gi, i find mount a difficult place to attack from. i much prefer side control.