Two Technical Lockdown troubleshooting questions from Head and arm

[Tyler_Casselman]

Hey guys,

So I was out at the gym today and I managed to make a short video going over the troubleshooting issues with Whipdown and Pimp Arm... as well as showing some of the things I have been using from Whipdown.



I know Sean has a video out there on using the 5-0 Sweep from Whipdown... but me personally I couldnt really get it to work well... especially if they have a heavy overhook and if there upper body is wide and thick.

Thanks

[Tyler_Casselman]

Also please dont post or share the video anywhere... its set to private... just for discussion and troubleshooting purposes

Thanks

[Daniel Siriphongs]

It is actually very possible to pass especially if you are decent at unhooking the lockdown with your feet. Movement is also not impossible on the bottom. Eddie made it work the second time against Royler with the whip down, but when I watch the match over, it looked to me the only time Eddie was struggling against the grain was when he lost the underhook in quarter guard and fought like hell to regain the underhook after he mini stomped to lockdown. Everything else was like butter.

I guess I am misunderstanding what the OP is saying. When I said it is a stalemate, I meant when someone has head and arm control and is squeezing the hell out of you. I’ve found that I have to extend the lockdown to get some pressure off my neck and wait until they lighten up the pressure and start to move before I can start whipping effectively. I can kind of flounder there like a fish, lol...but usually it just tires me out until they lighten up.

If there is a solution to breaking the squeeze, I would love to know what it is, because the squeeze is what a lot of the big guys do when I roll with them. I can’t get a jaws of life going when they are so strong.

[Daniel Siriphongs]

Hey guys,

So I was out at the gym today and I managed to make a short video going over the troubleshooting issues with Whipdown and Pimp Arm... as well as showing some of the things I have been using from Whipdown.



I know Sean has a video out there on using the 5-0 Sweep from Whipdown... but me personally I couldnt really get it to work well... especially if they have a heavy overhook and if there upper body is wide and thick.

Thanks

Nice video. The double stiff arm is called the Heissman, I believe. Eddie talks about it with the Reverse Lockdown in MTS 56. That heel hook you do is there too, I think. Seriously, watch MTS 56, lol.

And the c-cupping of the leg is a pimp arm. I think your solutions are working nicely. Training with same partners day in and out leads them to knowing your game. I find that they know how to counter my game and I counter theirs. It’s always an arms race...that is sometimes discouraging because you don’t know if you are improving until someone new comes in, lol.

[Daniel Siriphongs]

Nice video. The double stiff arm is called the Heissman, I believe. And the c-cupping of the leg is a pimp arm. I think your solutions are working nicely. Training with same partners day in and out leads them to knowing your game. I find that they know how to counter my game and I counter theirs. It’s always an arms race...that is sometimes discouraging because you don’t know if you are improving until someone new comes in, lol.

In MTS 71, Eddie talks about how the pimp arm kept Royler from no-hand passing. I do notice that he is on his side a little more rather than flat on his back, which I was always told is the most effective way to play Lockdown. It also seemed to allow him the space to go to Jersey or full guard. Not sure if that helps...y’all know more than I do for sure.

[Daniel Siriphongs]

Yeah, that heel hook is in MTS 56 at 01:48:00

[Tyler_Casselman]

@Daniel
Hey man,
To your first question about when they are squeezing really hard... for me using the Pimp Arm to the hip and then going up and pushing on the Arm pit to get to the Whipdown works pretty well... And honestly I try to avoid being flat on my back... Usually when I play LD I go straight to Whipdown IMMEDIATELY and dont give them a chance to flatten me out and get really heavy on top.

I will check out MTS 56... thanks for the tip

Yeah I remember when Eddie did that breakdown with Joe and he Talked about that... although Royler did not try to get the Double Unders from the Top... which some people say is safer and easier for the top guy to use to pass.

Hopefully a higher belt can chime in if they have any further insite into the Pimp arm C cupping the Knee and not the hip and then on the WHipdown as well

Thanks man

[Jon Watkins]

I guess I am misunderstanding what the OP is saying. When I said it is a stalemate, I meant when someone has head and arm control and is squeezing the hell out of you. I’ve found that I have to extend the lockdown to get some pressure off my neck and wait until they lighten up the pressure and start to move before I can start whipping effectively. I can kind of flounder there like a fish, lol...but usually it just tires me out until they lighten up.

If there is a solution to breaking the squeeze, I would love to know what it is, because the squeeze is what a lot of the big guys do when I roll with them. I can’t get a jaws of life going when they are so strong.

If you are in lockdown and the guy is squeezing head and arm really tight this for one thing seems like a noob reaction from the guy on top and two if you are extending your lockdown it seems like prime time for setting up the stomp, new stomp and the super stomp. Granted, if you are not good at it, you are probably going to get passed a lot starting out, but it will eventually be worth it once you get it down and get your options from butterfly guard leveled up.

[Jon Watkins]

Hey guys,

So I was out at the gym today and I managed to make a short video going over the troubleshooting issues with Whipdown and Pimp Arm... as well as showing some of the things I have been using from Whipdown.



I know Sean has a video out there on using the 5-0 Sweep from Whipdown... but me personally I couldnt really get it to work well... especially if they have a heavy overhook and if there upper body is wide and thick.

Thanks

Question 1

I think if you are going to C cup you need to trap your opponents arm with your head at least somewhat and anticipate the switch to double underhooks.

Question 2

If you are always underhooking like this, the whizzer is going to be less of an issue everywhere.


Question 2 continued

Provided it is legal, reaping the knee and locking it up with a sambo knot is always high on my priority list. I am not as big a fan of just entering into the reap and cranking the heel hook because advanced guys usually can turn out of it. The apollo choke is definitely a strong finishing option also, but I would be more inclined to use it to stomp and sweep. The 5 0 sweep was tough to make work for me also until I got good at rocking my lockdown legs while adjusting the positional advancement.


Having said all of this, I personally much prefer countering head and arm with the stomp, new stomp, and super stomp while trapping the arm around my neck with my head and neck by pinning my head to the floor with a slight bridge. I find it is usually less strenuous on my body playing this counter. Also the closer you can keep your elbow to the rest of your body while you are pimp arming will greatly reduce the possibility of dealing with double underhooks.

[Daniel Siriphongs]

If you are in lockdown and the guy is squeezing head and arm really tight this for one thing seems like a noob reaction from the guy on top and two if you are extending your lockdown it seems like prime time for setting up the stomp, new stomp, and the super stomp. Granted, if you are not good at it, you are probably going to get passed a lot starting out, but it will eventually be worth it once you get it down and get your options from butterfly guard leveled up.

Yes, it’s usually the newer guys that squeeze me lol. My stomp game is still weak. Gotta work on it. Thanks!