Gracie Worlds, NAGA, Five, it doesn't matter. If you want to be a World Champion, IBJJF is where it's at. Who will be competing among the best of the best this weekend?
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Gracie Worlds, NAGA, Five, it doesn't matter. If you want to be a World Champion, IBJJF is where it's at. Who will be competing among the best of the best this weekend?
Boogey is taking a contingent from 10th Planet San Diego. Walel is staying here to coach the rest of us at NAGA. Should be fun!
Mundials, Pan Ams, European Open, it doesn't matter. If you want to be a World Champion, ADCC is where it's at.
Protest bad tournaments, IBJJF only holds prestige because so many good guys show up to their stuff. I hear this years No-Gi Mundials is at a record low...
That's said, go get em' 10th planet guys that are showing up to this! If anyone can make grappling look good in that rule set its you guys :)
Are you doing Five Texas Brian?
That's the stupidest statement I've ever read on this forum. GtfoQuote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
Lol let me elaborate. Yes technically the only way to become a World Champion is to compete and win at the World Championship but "IBJJF is where it's at" is horse shit. For people to constantly complain about the rediculousness that happens at any ibjjf event but still support it is retarded. As soon as the top competitors stop supporting ibjjf and start supporting the great tournaments that are being put on by five, naga, and Gracie worlds/nationals/regionals the sooner the ibjjf will wither and die.
Spitting fire Brent
Five may as well be the IBJJF jr. IMO. But either way a comps a comp. But I agree with you Brent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Smith
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Smith
Slow clap. Well said.
Mogwai just got silver in women's feather. Lost to Ben Hendersons wife on points. No one else I follow from 10p has posted anything else.
Just to be clear I'm not hating on anybody that did compete at Worlds. Just stop it..right now
\Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Smith
Agreed. ADCC is the real world championship. IBJJF No-Gi is just an upstart attempt at no-gi by the Gisters. Hell, a lot of people on the Nibiru forum have been competing in no-gi longer than the IBJJF No-Gi Mundials have even existed. That's not even addressing that abomination of a rule set.
Down with IBJJF Worlds!
Long live ADCC, NAGA, and the other real no-gi tournaments!
RIP GQ!
Having said that, good luck to all the 10th Planet competitors giving it a go this weekend.
I'll watch whatever is on, on whatever mat it's on. Good grappling is good grappling. Good luck to all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
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Originally Posted by Brent Smith
So, shall we call that hesitant agreement? lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Brent Smith
I think theres actually multiple world championships, ibjjf is just one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
Rafael Lovato Jr competed at Five instead of IBJJF. Just saw his medal pics. Big statement right there, I think.
This^^^ I agree 100%Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Hanley
Would you call yourself a world champion if you won Gracie Worlds? Seriously, BJJ politics aside, if someone were introducing you to Xande Ribiero, Buchecha, Caio, etc, would you feel comfortable with them introducing you as a world champion?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Dewitt Jr
Rafael and Justin Radar both fought MMA bouts last weekend. One week isn't enough time to change your focus and prepare for Worlds, especially when he would have the added pressure of having to defend his title. He has won NoGi Worlds in three different weight classes though, so that's a big statement right there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Mccaghren
I think Lovato went to chase prize money. Why do a competition for free when you can do essentially the same competition and win a couple thousand dollars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
Watching the black belt finals now: www.ibjjf.tv.
So, what I'm reading is that Joseph likes the IBJJF No Gi Worlds.
Did I get that correct?
Did you watch the live feed? What's not to like?Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Mccaghren
I did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
There were a few things to like. I liked the way Miyao went for the kill even when he was ahead in points. Gangster.
But what does it say about a Jiu Jitsu event when everyone is talking about how cool it was that somebody actually came for blood for a change?
Things I hated: black belt finals had 3 straight close outs. What other sport's world championship has a conceded final? That's EMBARRASSING. There's no way to excuse that, I'm sorry.
I thought some of the strategies employed were silly and devoid of the nature of the sport. Getting a takedown and stalling as a strategy? Madness.
In no way am I disparaging these athletes; they are incredible Jiu Jitsu players who would be amazing in a different format, as well. But the format is gross. It's gross.
And for the Black Belts to be PAYING for a World Title tournament entry strips the world title of it's legitimacy. If the tournament is not invite only or open to the best (not just the ones who can afford to get there) then it is not a world championship. It wouldn't be in any other sport, why do we pretend like it is in ours?
These are the usual IBJJF gripes that echo throughout this forum that, for the most part, I agree with. But refusing to compete on our sports highest stage because you don't like the ruleset is a tragedy. The IOC has all kids of criticism, but I don't see the high jumpers refusing to compete because they measure the jumps in meters instead of just seeing who jumps higher! That's a silly example. My point is that 10th Planet is full of beasts who specialize in NOGI jiu jitsu. It seems extremely silly not to send our best guys forward to showcase the system.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Mccaghren
I think using the example of meters is a poor example....we are talking dq for reaping in black belt competitions. Guys getting an advantage and not attacking or improving after that.
You really think it's a higher stage than ADCC?Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Hachey
Gary tonon using the lockdown to electric chair. He uses lockdown the whole match. Just looks like he needs to tighten transitioning from electric chair.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQxqh...ailpage#t=4742
Edit: ah it isn't going straight to the time. It's at the 1 hour 19 min mark.
Rules can be changed and should. AJ Agazarm won gold by getting 2 points on a takedown and then purposefully stalling, receiving 2 penalties to burn time before he engaged in the match again. THAT is egregious. The closeouts need to stop. It happens waaay too often.
One suggestion made by the commentators was to have teams on "one side of the bracket" so that they face each other earlier and must chose THEN, instead of the final, where another team would have made the same choice in a quaterfinal match. That way, in the final, when we are paying attention, you are guaranteed two people from different teams.
Final thought: time to go through the interwebs and look up Yuri Simoes fight vids. Beast.
Agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Mccaghren
I don't think he's a lefty. So he was forced to play weak side lockdown. It's not as instinctive to play weak side LD unless you really put in the reps. From his transition to the back, instead of using the twist back or just using stoner control, I don't think he puts in reps as much as he toys with it while rolling. But I could be wrong. Might just be his personal preference. Damn shame though. He could've gotten sweep points and worked his top game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Eddy
This is what he did to Denny as well. He does it to a lot of guys. One thing I'll give him credit for is that he is a positional beast. His style might do well in MMA. Might. Big "might." Because in order for your positions to really be effective in MMA, you have to throw strikes from those positions. But to throw strikes, you have to have a killer instinct. With AJ's positional dominance, he could be a Cain Velazquez style MMA fighter. But I just don't think he has the killer instinct. He would be more of a Jake Shields/Jon Fitch grappler.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiseop
That said, my favorite AJ match was against Tonon in the kumite when he dominated position for 20 minutes straight, and ended up getting RNC'd for all his troubles. Hhaaha.
.
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v...115627&fref=nf
Watch Tom DeBlass (one of Gary Tonon's instructors) get ROBBBBBBED!! This is the IBJJF for you. There are Brazilian rules and American rules apparently. Not only does the ref clearly start the match, clearly watch DeBlass pass Comprido's guard, but then he restarts the match, this time allowing Comprido to get an underhook on the leg. Absolutely ridiculous. And I'm expected to respect this org as the #1? Nah. Guys need to boycott IBJJF.
AJ is the worst, saw him on This Week in BJJ, right after american nationals. i dont think i saw 1 sub attempt in gi or nogi, he just hugged denny and stalled his ass off.
would love to see some of these world champs compete in sub only and see how they hold up
They'd probably do great.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Alexander
The problem isn't necessarily the athletes; it's the rule set. Rules determine strategy and tactics. AJ plays intelligently and plays to his strengths. I don't blame him. I would do the same if I were competing in that tournament. If I'm entering im looking to win.
I don't fault AJ or anyone else for playing to that rule set, really. But I don't have to like the tournament.
The biggest thing I dislike about the IBJJF is the disparity between referee's and competitors. I've competed in a few IBJJF's and if you're going against a guy with a Brazilian head coach, that competitor will most likely get every advantage, reset advantage, and be allowed to stall for 10-20 seconds longer than a guy with a non-Brazilian head coach. (Garry Tonon's match against the Brazilian guy is a huge example)
Now I think reaping and stuff turns alot of people off which is fine, it doesn't bother me one way or the other.
Yes the best a lot of times compete there.
No I'd never introduce myself to anyone as a world champion, that doesn't make me who I am. I've won gracie worlds twice, and at no point in time would I introduce myself as a world champion. If I won the IBJJF World Championships I wouldn't introduce myself as a world champion. That's cocky. Now if someone came in and asked who's plaques or medals those were I'd say those are mine.
The IBJJF is crooked, I compete in them because 10P gets no love from them, and If I can sub my way to the podium they'll be forced to listen crooked reason or not.
THE ONLY REASON I COMPETE IN THE IBJJF IS SO THAT THEY HAVE TO SEE THAT 10PJJ LOGO ON THE PODIUM.
Not so I can say I'm the #24 Ultra Heavy in the world or the #105 Blue belt yada yada yada Bullshit.
I compete for the boys and girls of 10p so we can be heard. I figured that's why y'all compete as well (yes to test ourselves) but to contribute to the greater good of everyone under the 10th Planet Banner so we can be a force like G.B. or Alliance one day.
Just my 2 cents.
Not a great example, but during the bjj kumite it seemed that AJ got subbed an awful lot, cant knock him tho because it was to great grapplers, but it seems that the guys who play that stalling game dont seem to be able to lock in the kill because they dont actively work for the sub if that makes sense? idk :)
Thanks for saying this. I get a little sick of hearing about Worm Guard or De La Spider or a shoulder lock that I am not sure has a name but that we know about because it got used successfully at worlds.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mejia
I don't want us to look like Wing Chun or Ninjutsu or Krav Maga explaining why there are never any Ninjutsu champions in the UFC like "Well, the UFC doesn't allow throat attacks or small joint manipulation, they're just openly anti-ninja. It's not real fighting." Sounds weak.
If we've got something to prove, let's prove it and prove it wherever people are watching, neh? :D
Couldn't agree more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Mccaghren
It does really hurt us, in a sense, that we have such a negative stance against ibjjf and points tournaments. Pretty hard to make any argument for 10pjj when our guys only compete at small tournaments like gracie worlds (pretty much an all 10P event still at this point) and 10P put on events like EBI. The only people trying 10p techniques at the black belt levels in these point tournaments are people not from our school. These point tournaments are the only BJJ stage at the moment to put technique on display. The only other option is Metamoris. It would be great to have one of our top guys on a Metamoris card, but the hard thing there is it's kind of hard to build a resume/following for you to get invited if you're only competing at random unknown comps. You might beat some big names in those lesser known comps (geo vs glover), but less people will know about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mejia
It's not like the 10P system's techniques translate poorly in a point format. We go for subs often (a good strat for advantages) and Eddie's style in particular is very well suited for points. It's very systematic from quater guard to better position.
It's not a conspiracy that 10p moves are questioned. The only people to bring them to the bigger stages so far are Eddie and every so often from people outside the system. And that's too bad, because we have guys at that upper level. ADCC, IBJJF, any stage that has the eyes of the bjj scene, we need to be at. It's sad that when I go scrolling through footage of the top JJ comp of the year the only person I see hitting electric chairs is a guy outside of our school. We should change that..
I was gonna post the same thing. It seems that when you train for points, that's all you seem to get. I'm sure he'd do great against a lower belt, but against guys his own level, he tends to just win the position battles. I mean, he did compete in a sub only no time limit format and didn't do great. That says a lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Alexander
Ben Eddy gets it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Eddy
ADCC clearly takes the cake for nogi grappling accomplishments. This is unfortunately right up there under it as far as prestige goes. I'm not a huge fan of the format myself but would love to see more 10th P on the podium. Props to all those that put it out there. It's a super deep bracket usually and loaded with talent. I wouldn't be opposed to doing them if I could get some sponsors.