If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.
Ban Him
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If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.
Ban Him
I'm interested to see that but it won't let me view it, is it short enough to copy and paste? If its too long don't worry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall
I wanna say ban him for disrespecting Einstein and Eddie, and calling other ppl ass kissers and what not...but he's The Fucking Man, c'mon.
I just got home and found this and would like to reply and hope it can clear up some things. First of all, I wasn't trying to say eddie was not doing his part as the master of this system. I was merely giving, and I can see how it could be perceived as bad looking back, a shout out for kevin and neale, two instructors who I think exemplify tpjj. Secondly, when I got pressed on the forum, I felt insulted, so I responded in kind, and if you read the post, the thread addressed to jay chow was to show him how I felt insulted, and Immediately posted again to the contrary and let him know that was all I was trying to do and that I didn't mean it. he seemed to understand and said no problem. third, as far as "theman" goes in my name, I explained that as my name is very plain and common, and in the past, sighing up for email and websites was always hard to get sing on, A friend, as a joke meant to bust my balls, typed it in, and it went through, so I've used ever since, kinda to bust his balls back, like haha jokes on you. And yes, it sounds cocky, but its easy to remember and Its always available, so I've always used it. I dont believe for a minute that I'm the baddest guy in the world, but just a guy that loves martial arts, to be honest, tpjj more than all the rest at this time. I'm very passionate about it, and if thats bad, then Im bad. will I make mistakes, sure. Ive fought for things my whole life being that I grew up poor, but it doesnt make it right, just habit. I just spent three hours teaching my students tpjj techniques trying to learn all I can and better myself to it in hopes that one day I would be an affiliate, but if Eddie thinks that I am bad for tpjj and that my heart isnt devoted to it 100%, then I would rather not be involved and will gladly step away, rather than hurt or tarnish its image. Yes, I believe in standing up for what I believe and when we do that, someone will always disagree, thats life. I never meant anything bad towards anyone on here, but yea, I have had some heated debates with some, but I have always tried to give good advice to help others when they had questions, I have always supported this system 100%. And for those of you who seen where I challenged a gracie brown belt, yea I did, because he told lies at the very beginning of the facebook thread about me and my fiance on things that he had no idea of what he was talking about, but since all of that, he and I have talked at walmart, where I invited him to a seminar that I was doing with kevin green, no problem. I thought very highly of him before the fb issue and referred a lot of people to him for bjj as I believed that he was and is one of the best guys in eastern nc for it. When he said what he said, I was upset and overreacted, and for which was reprimanded by Jon helton, who helped me see my mistake and showed me a different path that I could of taken, also Neale Hoerle expressed his concerns and also helped me understand the ramifications for it. I've tried exhaustedly all I can, with limited resources to train with others in this system, and If their opinion counts, I think that they know my background and understand my passion, and my faults. But never let it be said that I don't want what is best for tpjj, and if that includes excluding me, I will understand and walk away.
To Eddie, sorry for suggesting in anyway that I knew more than you, I never meant to, but I can see reading back now, how it could be perceived as such. I really only meant it as a compliment to Kevin and some of his students that I have had the pleasure of meeting and working with. To jay chow, I explained the name calling to you and thought we understood each other, if not, I'm sorry again and it was just meant to get a reaction out of you which I did, and much the way that I felt a lot of others were doing to me at the same time. I've discussed it with Einstein via email and thought he better understood my position with him and thought we were good also, If not, let me say now, that while I did not agree with his original statement, I have the upmost respect for him as a person, and a bb.
The truth of it guys, if all of you had the pleasure of meeting me in person, I'm sure that you would see that I am just a guy that loves this stuff and I am willing to share anything I know with anybody, but usually end up walking away feeling I learned way more from you all. Sorry to everyone that all this came about. Whatever you all decide I will honor.
Frank James
I have one question, I read that Face book exchange through the link, since it seemed to be the cause of that Brazilian arrogance thread here months back. I noticed when speaking to those guys on face book, you never mentioned a purple belt from Charuto, yet you did mention it here. It seems, if a person was making a JJ argument, as was going on there with FB, making mention of being a purple under a guy like Charuto, would be part of credentials listed, since you listed the other stuff you did.
That struck me a bit odd.
thank you chris for your support, sorry to you for putting you in this position that might not be agreed to by others, and I would never want anyone to think less of you for any reason, so very much, Thank youQuote:
Originally Posted by Chris Herzog
thanks for understanding gregQuote:
Originally Posted by Greg Allum
thanks bill for nailing it and understandingQuote:
Originally Posted by Bill Keeling
my membership just expired as I had surgery last month and was out of work for a couple of weeks, had planned on renewing tonight till all of this. I'll wait the outcome and if it goes good, I will go from there. Your address is Raleigh, maybe we could meet some time and let you get to know me and maybe you will see that Im not that bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben
membership just expired, money has been real tight and I was out of work after surgery, and yes every dollar I make is paying past dues bills. hope you understand thanksQuote:
Originally Posted by derrick ikwueme
thanks Matt, you and I have spoke and tried to make arrangements to get together and train, so I think you know I'm not a douche. appreciate youQuote:
Originally Posted by Matt Glach
Totally agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by John Alighieri
thank you jon. I think you understand the shoes im in and thanks for your kind words. Everyone makes mistakesQuote:
Originally Posted by Jon Watkins
thank for understanding and seeing that people sometimes screw up even if they have the best intentions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andr'es (Andy) Lopez
Ive tried to thank everyone who took a positive stand and said give me a chance, if I missed anyone, thanks to you. For those who voted to ban me, I'm sorry that you feel that way, but I guess sometimes when we write words on a screen, the tone, whether it be light or serious, good or bad, cannot be expressed in black and white. I wish that I could meet all of you in person and let you get to know the real me, and I get to know you all. I'm sure that things would be different. I hope the best for all of you.
hi, i have never posted on here but this time i feel the need to chime in. let me start off by introducing myself. my name is jake whitfield. i am a brown belt under royce gracie and a professional mma fighter (my record: http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/f/DA...les-Whitfield/ ). i also own triangle jiu-jitsu academy here in north carolina (www.trianglejj.com). i know frank personally and feel like i have something to add.
first of all, let me start by saying some of the things that frank is going to say about me. first, he is going to say that i'm a punk kid. well i really have no way to argue that since it is his opinion. second, he's going to point that i have been very critical of eddie and 10th planet. this is absolutely true. i am a traditional gracie jiu-jitsu teacher and i'm proud of it. i have been highly critical of how eddie portrays his style and some of the things he teaches and i will continue to be.
i moved to goldsboro, nc in may of 2008 and my first encounter with frank was about a week before i fought tim mannon. i was working the bag at my gym and this little car pulls out. out of the car steps this large guy in an even larger tapout shirt. so i start to talk to him. he tells me that he is frank james and that he used to teach at the other mma gym in town. he tells me that he was given a purple belt by the head of nova uniao in north carolina to which i replied "oh you mean jeremy owens from evolution? yeah jeremy is a really good friend of mine." then frank changed his story and said that he wasnt actually given a belt by jeremy but that jeremy said that he was a purple belt level. next he tried to tell me that he was really good friends with charuto and i replied "oh yeah? thats cool. i trained with charuto last week." now he starts backpedaling and trying to tell me about his awesome stand up background and how he had taken one of his students down to a kickboxing gym in wilmington to be evaluated. and i said "oh you mean john maynard at champion kickboxing? yeah hes the one who gave me my black belt in kickboxing". now frank didnt know what to say so he tells me (direct quote) "well small joint manipulations are really my forte." at which point i informed him that i had to get back to training.
over the next few months, frank would pop into the gym occasionally and hang out and try to tell me more bullshit. i was always polite to him and would always ask if he wanted to roll but he would always have a reason why he couldnt. then he finally scheduled a private with me in january of 2009. he asked me some fairly ridiculous questions then we rolled. we rolled about five minutes and he tapped about six times. only one of those times was a legitimate submission. the other times was "oh man i cant breath, get off me". then he offered to help me with my stand up and i said "sure wanna spar?" so we put on some gloves. most of the stand up training was me stalking him around the mat and him running away. finally he stepped in and hit me with one jab. it landed solid but did nothing. frank however reacted like he had just killed me "oh my god man are you ok?" i just looked at him and was like "yeah it was just a jab dude keep going." finally he stopped running and i landed a few combinations and he said he didnt want to spar anymore. i remember that day very well because it was the day that grandmaster helio passed away. i got done training with frank and got a text saying that he had passed and all i could think was "what a disgrace! grandmaster helio passes and i'm hear training with this guy."
frank didnt come back into the gym for awhile after that. maybe six months later he showed up again. i was having royce at my place for a seminar and had sent out a mass text to everyone in my phone about it. so frank shows up... wearing a BLACK BELT! lol frank does the whole seminar and at the end of the seminar when royce is about to do evaluations he says "ok, everyone with more than a years experience on this side. everyone with less than a year on the other side." and frank mr black belt went over to the side with less than a years experience! haha
once again, i didnt hear anything from him for a long time. then about six months ago, one of my students posted a video on facebook on how to counter the rubber guard. frank left a rather rude reply saying that my student didnt know what he was talking about. one of my other students posted a response with two videos showing my guy using the exact countrer in competition. at which point frank said something about how it would never work against someone that really knew 10th planet jiu-jitsu. now i had enough so i replied and said that frank james is a phony. not only does he have no business being an mma coach but he certainly has no business criticizing my student who has competed many times and done very well. this set frank off and frank started attacking me and calling me names so i offered for frank to come by the gym and roll. he said he didnt want to roll, he wanted to fight. so i offered for him to come by the gym and we could put some gloves on. he told me that he didnt want to do mma because mma was for pussies that needed to hide behind the rules. he wanted to fight me in the street and he was going to pull my eyes out and stomp on my head and all this stuff. i posted one more time pointing out that at no time did i ever threaten this man. all i ever did was offer for him to come by the gym and train. i didnt respond for probably 70 more comments. when i did it was to copy and paste a message from jon helton. frank even went so far as to tell a black belt, a black belt that placed third at the pan ams, that he didnt know anything about jiu-jitsu. for the next month everywhere i went, people were asking me what was wrong with that psycho.
finally a few weeks ago i saw frank at walmart. i simply went about my business but i did keep my eyes open. frank is well known around here for sucker punching people. i have many students who are law enforcement officers and they all talked about how many times frank has been arrested. there is even a law in a local county for "habitual misdemeanor assault" that was created specifically for frank. eventually frank ended up in line behind me. as he walked up, i turned to face him so he could see that i knew he was there. our conversation went like this:
frank: hey man hows it going?
me: fine
frank: when are you fighting again?
me: march or april, its up to the promoter
frank: oh man thats cool! i'll have to make sure i'm there...long pause... i'm having a seminar at my gym
me: yeah with the guy from delaware
frank: yeah! want me to drop some fliers off at the gym
me: nope, its not my thing
frank: yeah i know but it never hurts to broaden your horizons
me: yeah but that stuff doesnt interest me. obviously eddie has proven that HE can make it work at a high level, but i dont really care for most of it.
frank: yeah theres a lot of stuff i dont like to with the names and everything
at which point, i took my bags and walked away. then i hear how hes telling people on here that i was scared and how there was almost a show at walmart. you folks dont know me, but i can promise you this: the only thing about frank that scares me is his punch from behind. frank james is a bully and bullies are no threat to anyone that will stand up to them.
eddie, like i said in the beginning, i have been vocal in my dislike for a lot of the stuff that you do and say. you are an authority with a unique amount of influence in the bjj/mma community and i dont always agree with how you use it. personally, i play rubber guard quite a bit and the twister back take has become one of my favorite ways to get to the back but the way you present the sport bothers me. i have respect for you as a jiu-jitsu practitioner. to beat royler, you have to be pretty freaking good no matter what the circumstances. but i also have to say that after reading this thread i do also have more respect for you as a person. i'm glad to see you taking steps to protect your name and your students from someone like this. i would love a chance to talk with you one on one about some of my feelings, but this is all i have to say about this matter. thanks.
I want to personaly say thank you Mr. Whitfield you just confirmed all my suspicions and that is a perfect example of disagreeing in a respetfull way.
oh and one last thing. i talked to jeremy owens of evolution mma (www.evolutionmixedmartialarts.com) AND charuto in the last two weeks and they both confirmed to me that frank was never given a purple belt by either of them. feel free to send jeremy an email and he will tell you the same.
thank you sir that was a powerful statement again thank you and all the best
Jake Whitfield: In the legal world we call that hearsay. Honestly, I think it's rude and disrespectful to come on here for the first time just to blast one of our members, the system and our master! Yes, you did it in a "respectful" dialog, but I still find the act itself to be extremely disrespectful to all of us, especially Frank, and Eddie. You should have sent that message to Eddie himself because now you've besmirched Frank's name to no end in front of the entire family and you have no business doing that since you are not a part of this family, in fact you're a self-proclaimed hater of this family. All of your stories are clearly loaded with bias and you are portraying Frank as a despicable person which is completely unfair to him. If all of what you say is true I would be very surprised because all of my encounters, albeit they're limited to text, have been nothing but pleasant. It's a shame to think that what you've said might be substantively factual, however I'm most certain that you've made him sound worse than he is. On the flip side, if you actually are being completely candid and not exaggerating, I guess I can say thank you for taking the time to let us all know, but I still think it would have been more tactful and respectful to send this to Eddie first and let him choose whether or not to share it with us all. Some instances of libel one just can't recover from, true or untrue, and this feels like it might be one of those instances.
Oh well, what's done is done, but I just had to tell you how I felt about that one. Sorry Frank, I hope these allegations prove to be false, but either way keep your head up and keep training. With jiu jitsu comes humility. We could all use a little more humility.
Well, the only thing he said in his post, for the most part was stuff Frank said in other threads (the Brazilian arrogance thread) just from a different perspective. Other than the detail about Charuto not giving Frank a purple belt. He says he talked both to Owens, and to Charuto and gives a way to email to confirm......that looks pretty strong in so far as backing a claim. Of course he is biased regarding Frank, they dont like each other, both said so. But he also gives a means to fact check the only thing that isnt confirmed (in different versions on both sides) by giving an email linl.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Glach
Even if it's all true to the letter, I still disagree with the way he posted it here. It's not his place to do so, he can talk to Eddie and allow him to use his discretion since this is his forum, his website, his family (our family but he is the father). An outsider has no right to come on here and speak the way he did of any of us, frank, eddie, quatoof, anyone. But I'm not one to get all mad and up in arms about something so insignificant so I'll leave it at what I've said. Nothing but love here. Nothing but love.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlnl
Well he posted it here because Frank was mentioning him by name the other day in a discussion. Who is more family here by the way, a legit Brown belt, or a guy who seems to have lied about grappling credentials? If Frank didnt lie, and is indeed a purple under Charuto, it is most certainly way, way out of line. If he did............well
Eddie oppened this for discussion in a public forum. I dont think he "blast(ed)" Eddie he actualy paid respect. As far as Jake speaking on Franks criminal record Frank himself has confirmed most of those things himself on this forum.
I still like to give a guy the benefit of the doubt, at least until we hear his side of the story. And you seem to be missing the point of family. An outsider, no matter what his belt color, is not family. He openly "hates" 10th planet. Frank has never lied to me, and he's been nothing but nice to me, and he has participated in countless discussions on this forum, so regardless of the allegations, I do consider Frank to be a part of this family, and I do not consider Mr. Whitfield to be a part of it. Whether Frank will continue to be a part of this family in the future remains to be seen, that will ultimately be up to Eddie. Let me be clear that I'm not defending Frank's alleged actions at all, I'm just saying give the guy a chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by stlnl
That's a good point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan Wylie
i dont think it was really all that rude. he was just telling us his story. and i belive it. there are a bunch of ppl out there that bullshit about were they train and what belt they are. i think a month or 2 ago we had the same prob. a guy saying he was a brown belt. when it turns out he got it from some fake or somethin like that. and than that dude that had the 10th planet logo on his site from australia. i think the dude is a fake. and u can tell he has a bad temper just by the stuff he was saying in his posts
Understandable. So, do you think Charuto has lied about Frank, that he gave him a purple belt and now has decided to lie and say he did not? That one thing, to me, in this "MMA age" where fraudulent instructors seem to pop up at every corner, galls me more than any aggressive arguments on the forum or personal issues he had with Jake Whitfield.
For the most part I take back and forth on the forums as just interaction and nothing too personal. But keep in mind, this is a fellow who is seeking 10PJJ affiliation, and seems to have said he was a rank he is not. That, to me, needs looking into.
Well to be perfectly honest, I think what Mr. Whitfield said was probably pretty accurate, and I'm sure the people he cited can most likely confirm it all. It's unfortunate, and it saddens me that the 10th planet reputation might lose a slight bit of clout, but those actions certainly are not representative of the rest of us. Personally I could care less about rank and I'd be perfectly happy as a white belt the rest of my life if not for the fact that I'd be extremely disappointed with myself for failing to progress. And of course I think it's wrong to represent a rank that you haven't earned but I do understand the male psyche and sometimes people make mistakes and say things they wish they could take back. Granted it seems to have happened more than once with Frank, but still, I get it. I'd never lie about belt color just because I think it's disrespectful to the system and those who are dedicated to its rules and recognitions. But don't we all deserve second chances?Quote:
Originally Posted by stlnl
I attended Neale's RG seminar that Frank had a major part in organizing. I was extremely impressed with everything about it. Frank was awesome, Neale was awesome, even Frank's girl Michelle was awesome. Frank is really passionate about the 10P system and like every last one of us, admires Master Eddie Bravo. I can't comment about anything negative. I'm also pretty shocked to read about some of the claims made against him. If they are true or not I believe in forgive and forget. Life's too short to be bickering. If Frank apologizes to the appropriate parties which it appears he already has, then let it be.
The person who we should be asking is Neale. I'm just a paying member of this website, have only attended a handful of classes with John Roderick, and went to the RG seminar with Neale. He is the journeyman who has probably spent the most time with him and is a journeyman who has put his licks in with 10PJJ.
MATT,Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Glach
I think Jake brought a compelling argument to the table based partly in personal experience with and from the police records of James. A repeat offender to such the Nth degree, that they wrote a statute to deal with future offenders like Mr. James.
First it was hearsay and now it's fairly accurate? Make up your mind flip flopper. You are part of the reason people have a low opinion of defense attorneys and lawyers in general.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Glach
Jake, I don't want to hijack this thread into talking about this, but I want to mention that I don't know anyone with more love and respect for the sport of jiu jitsu than Eddie. I'm not sure what you've heard about how "he presents the sport", but every single day, I hear nothing but positivity towards the rest of the community coming from Eddie. It's never been about anything, but love for jiu jitsu and trying to further the sport. In fact, I don't know one Brazilian who's ever met and talked to Eddie and not developed a friendship with him (such as Marcelo Garcia, Ricardo Liborio, Vinnie Magaljaes, etc) or at the very least, had a good rapport with him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Whitfield
Further, there's an attitude of having a open mind at 10th Planet - we're not anti Gracie or anything like that by any means (I'm not saying you've said that we are) and my friends and I regularly train with guys like Marcelo, Cobrihna, Galvao etc. Anyways dude, you seem like a reasonable person so I hope that when you're in LA, you swing by our gym and I think you will be surprised.
Quote:
Originally Posted by djradoff
hang on man, I think he was trying to concede to our points not flip floping no need to start insulting him.
Never tell evil of a man, if you do not know it for certainty, and if you know it for a certainty, then ask yourself, 'Why should I tell it?'
Johann K. Lavater
That which is everybody's business is nobody's business. And that which is nobody's business, is everybody's business.
Izaak Walton
The world is watching........
I'm gonna leave this one to Mr. Horse...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRaoHi_xcWk
Well seeing that I was one of the people on the Brown Belt thread that was referred to a Troll, Asshole, Clown or Butt Pucker (I am not sure which one was meant for me) I would like to give my thoughts...
Does Frank have alterior motives to get guys around him promoted in 10th Planet JJ? I am not questioning Kevin at all as I have heard great things about him but if Frank is really what he seems to be and everyone's suspisions are true maybe Frank is trying to ride Kevin's coat tails....
And if I were on here "screaming at Eddie" to get one of my team mates or friends promoted (which common sense would never allow me to do) Herzog would KICK MY ASS and make me apologize to everyone!
Also I am not aware of the past threads that have been mentioned here but seems like a pattern...3 Strikes...?
Kevin what is your opinion??
thanks very, very much Jason. But as I have already decided that most everyone has made up their minds, I have contacted everyone who I felt needed explainations and stated my case to them and I know what happen and for the record, so did Neale after many conversations with him about my background. I did change my belt to reflect my rank in tpjj as not to mislead everyone, btw, which is how a lot of this came about. Also for the record, I live in goldsboro, nc. and so that you know, it is a small town with approximately 6 schools that teach martial arts, 1 mma school that I helped open with a friend at the time Abi's mma, 4 traditional karate schools, and one bjj school that is jake whitfields. I can tell you that I had two of jakes former students contact me via fb about starting with me in feb. I personally never had a problem with jake until he insulted me and my fiance and spread accusations like on here that are hearsay and conjucture based off hearsay as jake himself stated has only lived in goldsboro for a couple of years, and considering that my last conviction for an assault was over five years ago. Yes I went to prison for spitting on my ex-wife, this is a fact that so many of you on here have pointed out by simply googling it. I was not charged with a crime made exclusively for me as jake puts it. I was charged in 1999 with habitual misd. assault which had been on the law books since 1996 had part of increased offenses for violent offenders. After I spit on my ex for one cheating on me, two leaving me for another man, and third and probably the main reason, for taking our daughter and running off with the man that she cheated with and leaving the state and refusing to let me see my daughter over the course of the next FOUR YEARS. Her father was the one who found this as of yet unused law and brought it before the d.a. as I had a previous record for assault when I was in my late teens and early twenties and was bouncing in bars to make extra money. Even though all of the charges that were used to coallate the habitual were from ten years earlier, I still qualified under the law, so I was the first case charged and convicted for it. I did 7 months in prison for it and was released in jan 2001. As for my training and my credientials, I think that I have been honest and forthwith in correcting anything that may have been misleading.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Correia
This has been humiliating and heartbreaking to see so many people who choose to believe someone who came on this forum for the soul purpose of discrediting me and that I am is rival in business where we live. In the whole facebook arguement, Jake even quoted, why would anyone want to train with a criminal who beats women and even went to prison for it, pretty much trying to ruin my reputation by using not my ability to teach and that I have been doing it for quite some time with many students to verify that, but choosing to spread conjecture and lies that he knows nothing about. Its al for nothing, because all I wanted to do is teach and to teach tpjj too, but since it seems that everyone has such strong opinions bout it on here, I have decided to discontinue my classes. Sorry to every member on the forum, I have asked that Kevin see to it that my profile be deleted and I removed many of you from my fb page as not to tarnish your images. thanks for the memories and your time.
So the guy was lying about you not being a purple under Charuto? You did get a purple from Charuto?