Verdum on Magalhaes loss. The White belts were correct.

shit ill amit my observation was wrong.do you guys think he prefers to have his legs open for a wider base and more control?

it's fucking werdum. us trying to point out what he did wrong is like me trying to tell eddie bravo what to do while he's rolling. It's fucking retarded. Armbars alone are way deeper and have way more variables than we can imagine. Believe it or not there's more than one right way to do things.

the only thing you can safely say is the technique werdum used on vinny works on every single person in the world, but in vinny's case, maybe he should pinch his knees. And we can't even be sure if he would have finished it even if he did that.

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Originally Posted by Caliphate Ishtar Allah

After seeing that armbar its hard to agree.




This is exactly what the new students have been saying. If he had pinched his knees and isolated your arm, Its reasonable to assume he would have damaged your elbow. I believe his desire to get a sound blinded his technique. He only tried to put your wrist under his armpit once and gave up first. One can see he is taking long deep breaths and listening for advice and tying to gathering himself.

I have re-watched the video and its clear Verdum never bridges, if he had push up with his hips he would have snapped your elbow joint for sure. You can clearly see Verdum is flat on his back the whole time. That is a good example of a bad armbar. Also your rash guard and clinched fist helped Verdum hold on for longer, an open palm and sweaty wrist could have allow his grip to slip off.





His partner isn't you clearly so it that doesn't help. Lots of moves done on high level guys will not make them tap. But you know this. Was his partner on his side with a high shoulder is a question to ask as well.




Monsoon is a 40 year old stiff wrestler/Muscle man, he is not a 27 year old BJJ guy in his prime. Your about 6,3? Monson is 5,8? His skeletal mechanics as in arm length are different, The same range of motion will crush his elbow when your longer limb will not experience the same degree of crush at the joint. Plus your shoulder was high up off the ground. If you had been flat on your back it think you will agree it would have been a different story.





He crossed his feet because he was hanging upside down! This isn't the same thing at all. His face on the mat, and body fully extended, not even looking at Jacare. That was perfect for the situation. Its just Jacare has a lot of heart and is very brave clearly.

Regardless of ones views it was a interesting fight and good lesson for anybody wanting to learn JJ do's and don'ts.

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Jesus christ dude. Its ok to not win a debate.

im tired of seeing this thread at the top lets kill it by not responding!

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Originally Posted by Isaiah Mendoza

it's fucking werdum. us trying to point out what he did wrong is like me trying to tell eddie bravo what to do while he's rolling. It's fucking retarded. Armbars alone are way deeper and have way more variables than we can imagine. Believe it or not there's more than one right way to do things.

the only thing you can safely say is the technique werdum used on vinny works on every single person in the world, but in vinny's case, maybe he should pinch his knees. And we can't even be sure if he would have finished it even if he did that.

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Like vinny said, he wasn't going to tap with only a couple mins left in the finals at ADCC

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Originally Posted by Vinny Magalhaes

This thread isn't making much sense, I'm sorry...

Werdum is saying totally the opposite of what you're claiming... He said on this video that that arm bar is his specialty, and that he did have his partner telling that he should have pinched his knee, that's why it didn't work on me, but then he grabbed his partner, did the move just like he did it on me, and the move still worked...
He even mentioned that he got Jeff Monson the day before our match, with exactly the same move, doing it exactly the same way...
As a matter of fact, this whole: 'don't cross your legs', 'pinch your knees', etc, are just little tricks that you want the beginners to know, so they don't develop bad habits and don't get to sloppy with their moves, in reality, there's no rule like "the arm bar will NEVER work if you cross your feet, or if you don't pinch your knees"...

Did you guys watch Roger vs Jacare when Jacare had his arm broken by Roger? Well, if so you'll remember that Roger had his feet crossed while applying the arm bar, and guess what, he still broke Jacare's arm.
Supposedly, you shouldn't cross your feet in arm bar from guard though, right?

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Originally Posted by Vinny Magalhaes

No, just like Fabricio said, it didn't pop at all, not even once... it was just annoying, because I felt like I was stuck in the arm bar, but it wasn't hurting...

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Originally Posted by Vinny Magalhaes

I don't think he messed up, like he said, that's his move, he caught Monson with the same move, with the same details... I'm not awesome, but i also wouldn't tap in the ADCC finals with only couple minutes left...

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Fuckin Vinny Mag. Pardon me while I nerdgasm. In my opinion, this settles it. Werdum is a black belt who's been armbarring nearly as long as I've lived. No mistake was mad. Vinny's just the man.

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Originally Posted by Jason Hyatt

I'm with you on this. I know how to do an omaplata, but some guys have much more flexible shoulders than others. As a result, I have to be that much more technically perfect with guy A than with guy B; the fraction of an inch I leave for guy B may be inconsequential on him whereas it's just enough to allow guy A to escape. Same thing with chokes. Some guys will tap to a sloppy triangle; other guys it has to be absolutely perfect or it's just not gonna happen. The higher level you go the tighter the tolerances become. If you want to armbar Vinnie, my guess is that you simply cannot leave him ANY room to move at all. Verdum obviously left him just enough room and we all saw the result.

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Thanks for the cosign. Good post.

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Originally Posted by Isaiah Mendoza

it's fucking werdum. us trying to point out what he did wrong is like me trying to tell eddie bravo what to do while he's rolling. It's fucking retarded. Armbars alone are way deeper and have way more variables than we can imagine. Believe it or not there's more than one right way to do things.

the only thing you can safely say is the technique werdum used on vinny works on every single person in the world, but in vinny's case, maybe he should pinch his knees. And we can't even be sure if he would have finished it even if he did that.

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who said he did anything wrong i was trying to discuss the best way to finish an arm bar. you seem like a pussy scared of peapole, if i don't understand why someone dose something i ask so i can learn more.

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Originally Posted by Tyler Timmermans

who said he did anything wrong i was trying to discuss the best way to finish an arm bar. you seem like a pussy scared of peapole, if i don't understand why someone dose something i ask so i can learn more.

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whoa there buddy I wasn't talking about you. And I love people, as long as they don't shart their pants at my house and leave their shit stained underwear under my sink. That's an exception.

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Originally Posted by Isaiah Mendoza

whoa there buddy I wasn't talking about you. And I love people, as long as they don't shart their pants at my house and leave their shit stained underwear under my sink. That's an exception.

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oh sorry i thought peapole where mad at me for commenting on the match because im a white belt. and i worked at a public park so peapole scare me on how gross they can be to.

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Originally Posted by Caliphate Ishtar Allah

Its never ok, to not learn from observations.


To err is human,to forgive divine.

I'm pretty sure Werdum is human, and nobody has said anything derogatory. There have been valid observations from which critique emanates. To castigate these opinions smacks of bourgeoisie.

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Werdum human sure, but Vinny is from the tenth planet and quite possibly not human...

I'm scared of peapole.