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The first two moves aren't douchey, they're just bicep slicers (probably douchey in the first match assuming the gi match doesn't allow them).Quote:
Originally Posted by Genrri
But I FEEL LIKE SCREAMING RIGHT NOW SON!! I've never seen/heard an elbow pop/tear from a slicer. Yo son I feel like crying right now. That shit sounded like velcro. Oh my God that was so cringe worthy.
Using your head to move another persons head (or prevent them from moving it) =/= grinding your forehead on their face.
"Douche move" is subjective man. I've rolled with guys who think knee on belly is a cardinal sin and looked at me like I was satan when I laughed about it. I thought they were joking. Cyborg Abreu teaches knee on neck. It's all subjective man. I know guys who think cross facing is douchey, but for other guys it's literally part of their basics curriculum.
In the end, do what you're taught, and do what you feel is right. I can draw from my own experience. You all know I hate using my size, weight, and strength advantage. But I recall doing drills back in 10thP Rochester and having a couple guys who didn't understand that we don't go 100% resistance in drills, so I gave them a little extra 20% of offense in the form of a little elbow pressure on the biceps to break their grip around my head. Douchey? Eh, maybe a little. But so is going 100% in live drills unnecessarily. But on the flip side, I'm not over here crushing fresh white belts with forearms in the eye sockets and what not.
Like Isaac mentioned. I think it's all about intent. Why are you doing what you're doing? To just be cruel? Or is there another goal?
My first encounter with a powerful knee on belly sorta frustrated me, but I learned how to deal with it. I have had people try to submit me while they are in my guard, pretty funny stuff.
you make good points aaron, i disagree with them but at the same time i can see what youre talking about an that my arguments are getting weaker against it. i do think i hit the nail on teh head when i said about intent though. i guess we all have our own boudaries, the reason i started the thread was to find out if people thought the fist choke was a douche move.
and using douche was jsut one way to describe it. easier than saying a move that isnt generally accepted because it makes you look like an arsehole for isntance.
The first time I roll with someone. I'm usually very gentle, and make sure I'm just rolling hard, but not really smashing them, it's hard to say. I can't stand wrist locks an heel hooks but, they're a fact of life. Does it make you a douche for using them, nope. I hate the can opener, but it is what it is. Just don't try and gouge my eyes out or stick your finger in my rectum and we're all good...Unless you buy me a drink first then my mind may change.
If we're gonna strip down to shorts and roll around all sweaty like I can't necessarily be held responsible for my actions...Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mejia
It just matters who your rolling with and in what setting. There are a lot of different goals out there for grapples and you need a variety of training environments to accommodate them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Isaac Atley
Im always thinking that in the near future all the different grappling styles will continue to unite until its all one discipline with a much more inclusive rules set. With that in mind i feel that if something is accepted in wrestling or judo or sumo ect, we need to learn it and if not use it ourselves, at least know how to defend/deal with it.
Things that are dangerous (like the fist chokes) are one thing; stuff that just hurts a bit or distracts is another IMO
I dont understand why people dont like the can opener? Just open your guard or use one of many counters. I could see that if you applied it like an ass, it would be a problem but that true of most submissions? Love wrist locks! Partly because they make people upset and i think that's funny. Maybe iam a douche. People feel cheated when they get wrist locked because they feel that they shouldn't have gotten caught by it and that its your fault because they are not common; not their fault for falling to recognize the danger. In most of the jiujitsu world people still feel this way about leg locks but the tide is turning.
Hey what can I say I'm easy to please... This thread may have taken a turn for the worseQuote:
Originally Posted by AKRhino
Im guessing you'd prefer it gentle?Quote:
Originally Posted by AKRhino