Bad Weed Debate on my facebook between myself & family

First off man we all feel your pain..

Next, your mother is being manipulated and brow beat by a mother who's probably been doing it for years. Just the tone of the letter, the words used, and the way it's constructed points to a woman who has always had her way with your mom (and maybe aunt) for a very very long time.. it's the 'don't you dare disagree with what I'm saying' stance.. with that being said your mother should be siding with YOU her SON.. instead she's going AGAINST you for her MOM.. which tells me the manipulation is still in full affect..

Second, your aunts a cop.. as the old saying goes 'never argue with a person whose job depends on not being convinced'.. but in reality if you look at the accidental deaths caused by the war on drugs it's astounding.. they say that people doing drugs cause the crimes, but I contend that the cops are almost at the same level.. ask her about the shooting of the dogs in front of their family a couple months ago on a botched raid.. or about the one recently where a 68 year old grandfather was shot.. for all their hype and fluff they are people who have no clue about the reality of things.. and they are unwilling to listen or learn.. your aunt should talk to the members of LEAP..

Finally, quit wasting your breath.. your family sounds like they treat you as an outsider.. it's not worth it to you.. just nod, smile, and wait until the next generation of politicians..

Believe me. Your head will give before the brick wall does.

This is the original subject that caused some of the controversy.

My facebook status

a crack head wielding a pipe lunged at a cop & the cop shot & killed the crack head. didn't taze the crack head, didn't shoot the crack head in the leg, didn't use mase & didn't use his night stick. the cop shot & killed him & the cop claimed that he used sufficient force to equal the crack head's force. give me a damn break.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
I dream that someday, we the people start taking our own actions. Imagine if someone would have seen the cop shoot the crack head & then they shot the cop. Then when the cops come for that person, we the people protect them kind of like a militia. This shit disgusts me.

Grandma (CA)
How quickly you forget your Aunt and Uncle put their lives on the line everyday dealing with sick crazies like your crack head so they don't hurt, molest or steal from you. And your response is "we the people" rallying to protecting the crazies! Maybe in your neighborhood, not in mine, not "my people." I think you would benefit greatly from a couple of graveyard ridealongs young man!!

Me (Kansas City, MO)
Tell that to my friend **** ******* & **** *'***** when the cops showed up & threw them down on the ground for no reason. The reason that cops do whatever they want is because they can. I bet they would think twice if everyone they dealt with had H&K assault rifles & bullet proof vests. This would force both sides to respect each other. Cops went from protect & serving to enforcing the law & its sad.

Grandma (CA)
Wonder what the police officer's side of the story sounds like. Seriously doubt it would start with "we just happened to come to a stop, saw these two nice boys doing absolutely "nothing," who politely asked if they could help us....." Sorry too much to do out there to just "decide" to start throwing innocent people around for no reason. Again, you need to walk in some bigger shoes for awhile.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
You should look up when 2Pac got beat up by the cops & sewed the LAPD & won. They stopped him for J-walking & didn't believe him when he said he was 2Pac. The cop beat the hell out of 2Pac & there were pics to prove it. Cops do whatever they want because they can. Its sad that a cop can arrest a citizen but citizens can't do a citizen's arrest to a cop. We have to jump threw hoops.

Grandma (CA)
There are "bad" apples in any barrel, from the church, to the workplace, to our schools and unfortunately in military and police uniform. However, to generalize "they are all like that" only reflects poorly on the accuser's maturity and intellect. Always remember you could be one of a "group" others have strong "assumptions" about and you are the proof it isn't so, if those others would only take the time to educate themselves on the subject!

Me (Kansas City, MO)
Well G-MA, I do believe that this would be improved if everyone took advantage of their 2nd amendment rights & started owning firearms. Some cops are ok, but I believe what Diabolic said in his song "Riot," "The People shouldn't fear their government, that's the issue. The government should fear the people's right to pack a pistol."

Part 2

Aunt (Detective in San Diego, CA)
Wow...Kevin, I guess your not interested in becoming a cop anymore? I put my life on the line every day. So does my husband and most of my close friends. Some of my friends have been shot & killed, attacked & injured, ran over & killed ...and some have been shot and live paralyzed for the rest of their life. I am hurt that you would make such CRAZY public statements regarding Law Enforcement as a whole....on here...and LUMP me and other those people I hold near and dear to my heart-into this "public statement" of yours. Then you'd encourage vigilanty type behavior, making statements you believe "people should bear arms and intimidate cops with them?".

People already do own guns and have the right to bear them (as long as they do it legally). The only people that can't...Felon's and those deemed Mentally Unfit. It's a rarity for me to run across someone who has a weapon and is a "normal" law abiding citizen...why? Because they are doing the RIGHT thing.

Things you'll learn over time...there is two sides to every story; someone can kill you with a pipe if they hit you with it and you'll never know what you would have done unless you were. I wasn't there...so I a cant say for sure what happened and I won't speak regarding THIS incident...but the LAW does hold us accountable for shooting someone and killing them. If after all the powers to be (and they are not cops...usually professional everyday people) get together and review it and feel that "in the eyes of a normal person" they wouldn't have done the same...we get prosecuted for it. Maybe this cop didn't have enough time to "do" anything else because it happened so fast? Have you even taken the time to find out? Or did you just an article, or hear it second hand?

This whole deal with "shooting" stuff out of peoples hands..or just shooting them in the leg is crazy. If I think someone is going to kill me with a pipe and I have to shoot them because I have no other option...I'm going to take lethal force. I'm going to STOP the threat...someone HIGH often is LESS than phased with a non-lethal shot and even when shot center mass they can manage to still come after you...so they and can still be a THREAT to me. Plus, when your adrenaline is running...how easy to you think it is to shoot at a moving, pipe welder target? I will be aiming for center mass...because I wouldn't want to miss.

G-Ma is right...you could benefit from some ride alongs. There, I'd do it in KC downtown or neighboring communities...cause Liberty is Calm in comparison...or out here in CA.

Curious....if a pipe welding crack head was about to attack Krissy and/or your mother and you only had a split second to react...what would you do?

You comment about 2PAC..You obviously have not read up on that one...Who do you think 2pac, Big e smalls and all the Sug Knight thugs had as their body guards.....LAPD police officers. That beat down you spoke of..Urban Legond....Read the book Labrynth. The only beat down was in Las Vegas...by security guards. Read the book, then make a statement.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
‎2Pac discussed it in an interview that was later put on the 2Pac Resurrection DVD. He said that he got stopped for J-Walking, the cop asked him who he was & the cop didn't believe that he was 2Pac. 2Pac asked for the cop to just write hi...m a ticket & the cop made racist comments & the cop threw 2Pac down & beat on him a little bit.

I do believe that the 2nd ammendment was put here for us to protect ourselves against the government & the police help inforce the government rule no matter what the people think about it. The people went out & rioted after the Rodney King beat down & the cops got away with that, the cops were the people that went & eventually stopped the people.

I do believe that some cops are cool. But ask my mom about the cop that pulled her over & asked her why she was impeding traffic, my mom went to answer the question & the cop stopped her & said, "tell it to the judge."

I've seen videos on youtube where cops beat on civilians for resisting arrest, not for fighting the cops but for just resisting. I can post lots of videos of that. If another civilian tries to go help the other civilian, then the cops arrest that person. I believe that we the people all need to start carrying pistols on us & assault rifles in our trunks so when messed up stuff like that happens, we'll make our own arrests. We'll arrest the cop. The cops treat us like shit because they know that we are weak. If we were strong, we'd be treated with respect.

Like I said, some cops are cool but I do wish that the people would revolutionize. I wish the people would file exempt on their taxes & save up all their money throughout the year & never pay it back. Then with all the money they have, go out & buy guns, ammo & vests. Then the government is missing a lot of the money that they were expecting & the people are strong again.

That's just my opinion though, but it will never happen.

Aunt (Detective in San Diego, CA)
This incident with 2pac...happened in Oakland...with Oakland POlice...not with LAPD...It was an allegation...he filed a law suit for 10 million, but "settled" for $42,000 dollars...why settle for pennies if it really happened ?

I'm still ...curious what you'd do if a pipe welding crack head was about to attack Krissy and/or your mother ..and you only had a split second to react...what would you do??

Grandma (CA)
Better start getting out of your room more and give up whatever you are smokin' cause you are really starting to worry your "main stream" relatives with some of these "off the wall" postings.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
I'm no mainstream guy. I've grown up a lot. I see how the government passes laws that are inhumane & the cops enforce them no matter how inhumane they are. Cops will arrest what they call a drug dealer, knowing all that dealer does is se...ll weed. They'll lock the dealer up for a long time for intent to sell.

You ever wonder why there are so many prisons. In 2009, 95,205 inmates were in the federal prison system due to drug related charges. That's 28.2% of the prison system in 2009 was due to drug related offenses. The reason is because the prison system makes money off these prisoners. Who do you think makes the US Military Uniforms? They pay prisoners pennies to make uniforms.

When cops arrest someone for weed, that's kidnapping plain & simple. But we don't prosecute the cops, we pay them. When cops are talking down to a citizen, we can't just ask for another officer, we have to deal with it. Go on youtube & type in Police Brutality & see what pops up. It's disgusting.

When it comes to 2Pac, maybe it was Oakland but he still won. In his interview, he said that he was tired of going to court. What does he need to keep going to prison for? The Money? He's a rapper & he has money. He took his money. He police department payed 2Pac $42K for J-Walking.

Thanks to the way that cops do business, I don't even talk to cops due to the following video.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik

&

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08fZQWjDVKE

Me (Kansas City, MO)
@ Alec
The man had a metal pipe, not a crack pipe. And to shoot & kill someone over a crack pipe is even worse.

Just before I made my comment towards Alec (Aunt's Son & My Cousin), he made a comment about how if he were a cop & a crackhead came wielding a "crack pipe" that possibly had aids or Hepatitis on it, that he would shoot him too. But he deleted his comment shortly after he left it.

Part 3

Mom (Kansas City, MO)
I'm very shocked by all of this. I have to go along with my sister Kim and your Grandma Sharon on this. I never realized you were filled with so much rage. I'm interested to know you never did answer Kim's question after she asked it twice.... I'm in favor of bearing arms but even with this there are restrictions and for the right reasons. I myself don't condone guns in our home. In fact I would be really angry to find out you owned a gun and brought it into our home! You need to look at life with realistic expectations and understand that officers do put their lives on the line every day for people like yourself who has a very clouded view of what the truth really is. You don't jump in on a fight with anyone no matter what without knowing what both sides of the story are. When it comes down to it officers only have seconds to make critical decisions I think a ride along would be an excellent idea.

A friend of mine in fact you know her to. Her name is Linda she was our avon lady for a few years. Her husband flew a chopper for the police and was doing his job putting his life on the line for us. He was helping the Kansas City PD with a person who was running from the police. While doing this his chopper went down and he was killed. When people like this avoid capture for whatever reason it puts many people at risk not just officers but the public which includes you. What if he had been your father that was killed would this change your views?

Please get out of this and move on with your life. Just as your Grandma mentioned there are good and bad people everywhere in every profession.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
I typed something out but it wouldn't except it because it had to many characters. Ill just say what Diabolic said, "The people shouldn't fear their government that's the issue, the government should fear the people's right to pack a pisto...l."

The government can do whatever they want because they have widdled us down to domesticated animals. For example, let's say the government decided to stop giving is physical money. They decided to hold it in an account & we have to apply anytime we want to purchase something & our purchases always have to be approved. No more cash. The people would get mad & let's say the people wanted to stand up for themselves. Guess who would be there to stop us. The cops. Fuck the cops. Their the biggest gang in the world.

My cousin just left this message today a few hours ago (01/12/2011). Just before he left his message, my aunt talked to my mom on the phone & upset my mom very bad. I tried to talk to my mom after their conversation but she was upset & she told me not to talk to her & that I'm a disrespectful person, I didn't say anything back because I didn't want to make the situation worse & I left. So while I was at my friend's house, my aunt sent me a message on my facebook & then about 10 minutes later, my cousin sent me his message. He waited through this whole debate, through this debate & the weed debate & then "in my opinion," seeing that his mom was upset & kicking me off her friend's list, he did the same.

Cousin (Detective's Son San Diego, CA)
look kevin im your cousin doug and kims son. i just took my test to be a police officer for san diego sheriffs office. I hate to do it cause your family but I have to delete you from my friends list so that when i go through the acadamy i w...ont be accociated with someone who bad mouths officers who put there lives on the line everyday so you can be safe from the people who want to do harm to you. i hope that you soon realize how your words and actions hurt family members. and others who have given their lives so you can live yours in peace

I wanted to say way more than this but my dad talked me out of it & urged me to not say anything rude to continue this because he didn't want to further upset my mom & everything she is going through.

Me (Kansas City, MO)
I deleted my last post because I don't want to upset my mom anymore. She is under a lot of stress & I feel that I'll be the bigger man. I still have my views & that's fine that you don't agree.

My parents & sister don't reflect the same vi...ews as myself, if you don't agree with my opinion, then that's fine. That is what's beautiful about the united states is that we can agree to disagree. Don't go attack someone else in my family regarding my opinion because they aren't the ones that expressed this opinion, I did. They are their own people & so am I. Being a good parent shouldn't be measured on weather or not you can raise your kid to think just as you do. Being a good parent should be about how well you prepare your child for the world & for your kids to know that they love you no matter what. Kids should be raised to question everything. And don't just believe everything that people tell them.

My mom loves Aunt Kim, she loves Aunt Cindy, she loves you & she loves Sharon. I personally can go my whole life without ever seeing you all again & it wont hurt me at all. I wont involve myself in my mom's business with you all & I don't believe that any of you should involve yourselves in her business regarding me because it's her business.

Go watch the movie "Reefer Madness." It was a movie made in 1936 & resurfaced in the 1970s which depicted stereotypes of weed smokers. Then once you watch that, you'll understand why "certain" people look down on weed. Then go watch "The Union: The Business Behind Getting High" & "Super High Me." Obviously it's the facebook debates that I had with Sharon & your mom regarding weed from my other 2 facebook status updates that made you feel obligated to come back here "de-friend" me.

Or don't, I'm my own man & I have my own opinions. I don't eat up everything that I'm told just because someone older than me tells me that it's correct. I don't believe someone that something is the way it is because they're older. I'm a thinker & I do my research, if that research doesn't fall under popular opinion, it doesn't mean that I'm wrong. Back in the day, people believed that black people were dumb & only good for hard labor & they weren't right. People thought the world was flat at one point & eventually that was proved wrong. There comes a point when we as people need to think for ourselves & I hope you do the same weather it goes with or against what I said. Good Luck with whatever you choose to do.

This is the message that my Aunt (Detective San Diego, CA) sent to me just before my cousin replied back to my old status:

Aunt (Detective San Diego, CA)
I wish you luck to your future. Sorry to say that due to approximately 10 people at work wondering what type of extremist I am friend with, the lack of common courtesy regarding me being Family and law enforcement.. I have chosen to delete you from my friend list. It is obvious that I do not hold any important role in your life, so I am sure it wont bother you at all. Given all the attention you have created at my job and your lack of common courtesy regarding the police (things are raw right now because we just lost an officer to someone who didn't want to get arrested on a warrant and thought the answer was to shoot and kill him)...I don't feel it's appropriate for me to be friends with you on here, its hurting and bothering too many people I know and care about.

There are opinions and feelings regarding things of this nature from many people, the difference with 99.9 percent of the people and you is...The choose the appropriate settings and use discretion in what they say.

I agree with everything.. for the most part.. wasn't able to get through every single comment. Other posters are right.. you're definitely wasting your time and breath.. don't sweat it so much.

Also maybe its just me.. but at least imo you should show them some more respect.. regardless of if you disagree.. they are your elders/family and something as insignificant as these debates shouldn't cause such a problem.. not saying you have to agree with them just move on.. because you aren't going to convince them with a facebook debate.

and you or others can say they don't show you any respect.. well they don't have to until you've shown that you deserve it.. however ridiculous their standards may be. etc.. imo. If you don't want their respect then why waste time trying to convince them etc..

The last debate I don't really agree with.. getting a little do extreme for me. While I agree cops have this feeling of authority over people because they feel they're infallible etc.. and its a huge problem. But also sometimes people are quick to say the cop is wrong in every situation and "captain hindsight" breaks out. As far as the original status goes.. If a crack head came at me with a pipe.. hes trying to kill me and I'm going to put him down as quickly as I can. Tasing him would be the most ideal situation but the world isn't ideal every second of the day. You won't have enough time to try and tase him then shoot him if that didn't work.. he'll already be bashing your skull in. And shooting him in the leg is not the easiest thing in the world.. your avg comp isn't a gunslinger and while i'm not a cop and have no idea what their training is like.. I can guess they at least recommend that they shoot a person in the chest etc.. when their life is in danger. Much easier to hit lol..

Basically focusing soling on that example.. could there be better options.. yes.. was the force used excessive.. imo no.

sorry if that made no sense its late and I came to browse really quick before bed.

I did apologize to my mom for 2 things. I apologized that I didn't use better judgment in sharing my opinion regarding cops being in my opinion to powerful. I knew that my aunt was a cop & that my uncle used to be a cop & I should have used better judgement in knowing that my opinion could upset them. It doesn't change my opinion but I just shouldn't have let it get this far but I feel no regret regarding my opinion on weed.

I also apologized to my mom regarding the timing of this whole ordeal. My parents had a vacation planned for the end of this month to San Diego, CA & they were going to visit family. I feel bad that this got in the way & now my parents don't even know if they are going to go, because of this bad timing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pourya S

I agree with everything.. for the most part.. wasn't able to get through every single comment. Other posters are right.. you're definitely wasting your time and breath.. don't sweat it so much.

Also maybe its just me.. but at least imo you should show them some more respect.. regardless of if you disagree.. they are your elders/family and something as insignificant as these debates shouldn't cause such a problem.. not saying you have to agree with them just move on.. because you aren't going to convince them with a facebook debate.

and you or others can say they don't show you any respect.. well they don't have to until you've shown that you deserve it.. however ridiculous their standards may be. etc.. imo. If you don't want their respect then why waste time trying to convince them etc..

The last debate I don't really agree with.. getting a little do extreme for me. While I agree cops have this feeling of authority over people because they feel they're infallible etc.. and its a huge problem. But also sometimes people are quick to say the cop is wrong in every situation and "captain hindsight" breaks out. As far as the original status goes.. If a crack head came at me with a pipe.. hes trying to kill me and I'm going to put him down as quickly as I can. Tasing him would be the most ideal situation but the world isn't ideal every second of the day. You won't have enough time to try and tase him then shoot him if that didn't work.. he'll already be bashing your skull in. And shooting him in the leg is not the easiest thing in the world.. your avg comp isn't a gunslinger and while i'm not a cop and have no idea what their training is like.. I can guess they at least recommend that they shoot a person in the chest etc.. when their life is in danger. Much easier to hit lol..

Basically focusing soling on that example.. could there be better options.. yes.. was the force used excessive.. imo no.

sorry if that made no sense its late and I came to browse really quick before bed.

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I appreciate your reply. When it comes to family, I don't show someone respect just because they carry my blood line in them or vise versa, I didn't grow up with them so I don't feel the "family" element behind this. I have friends that I've known a long time that I consider family & they don't carry my blood line. I completely understand where you're coming from & I'm fine if you don't agree with my opinion. I talked to my dad after this happened & he asked how far away the cop was from the crack head before the crack head started attacking him? Was he 1 foot away or was he 30 feet away & depending on how much time you are given to react to the threat will or may dictate how a cop handles that situation & I didn't have an answer for him, which made it wrong of me to comment on something the way I did without knowing about more the situation.

I stand by what I said regarding cops having to much power & I believe that we should all use our 2nd ammendment rights & if we feel that cops are doing something wrong, we should use them, not actually shoot the cops unless he pulls his gun out against us but just to get him to get off someone. There are numerous police brutality videos on youtube & if one of my friends is defenseless & getting beat up by the cops, it sucks that I can't help him or I got to jail. I have to record the situation & hope that the judge thinks that my recording is better than the cops spoken word. My dad doesn't agree with me, I understand that my vision is extreme & not everyone is going to agree & it's fine that you don't.

The thing about the weed debate is that My aunt & grandma weren't debating weed, they were attacking my character & due to that, I let my ego & pride carry the debate to somewhere that it shouldn't have went. Not because I didn't want to go there but because they didn't handle it like adults & called my mom harrassing & making her feel like she isn't a good mother because my opinion doesn't match what their opinion says & my mom didn't deserve that.

Interesting debate Kevin; in my opinion, I don't think it's a waste of breath at all, best to use it while you still have it ;) Being respectful of your elders for the pure sake of maintaining a pleasurable front isn't very healthy at all, in fact it stunts the growth of your relationship with them. Only when you can actively debate, ask questions of each other, and yes, do your due diligence and actually follow up on the research you discuss, can you actually start to respect each other's opinions in a real way, not just facetiously. Maybe facebook though wasn't the best place to have this sort of discussion where it involved so many family members at a time(technologies a bitch, esse), but hey everything happens for a reason, I think you needed to release all these ideas you had pent up and just wanted some earnest feedback from the people who love you. Your mom didnt know you were an athiest before, that's pretty huge, seems that's something that should be discussed more and in context to why your opinions differ so greatly from those of your elders. There's a new generation of enlightened thinkers out there that are just tired of the old religious rhetoric song and dance and pony show built to dissuade every intelligent arguement. Ultimately, your in control of your life, and it's your life to live, not theirs :)