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So while watching UFC 162 last night, Cora's coach want to show us a pass that he really like. He basically swear by this pass. Have any of you ever use this? And is it 10thplanet safe? It just looks to me like a flying kung fu or a meathook would nullified this pass. Or even a sweep. But he says its very effective against bigger guys with strong guard. Let me here what yall think. Thanks Bruce
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3VtRx8hWK8
Just want to add, this coach is not her regular coach. He is more like a coach assistant who happens to train there also. Just don't want anyone to get confuse with her Coach Cameron Graves.
There was a draculino Purple belt that loved this pass and got it on everyone else in our gym. It didn't work on me when he did it. You have to have very good control off guard angles to stop it against someone good... But I don't like it because I don't like to put time into move that I feel like ate programming me to get submitted by certain types of people. "train for the best defense". That said, lets of people in Houston like it.
^ lots of typos, sorry. My computer is sick and I'm posting from my phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Debes
Not everyone else in your gym! He didn't land it on me! Oh ya, I didnt roll with him...lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Debes
Popular pass around the Houston area. Im not a fan of it for all the reasons already stated...
So what can a 10thplanet guy do too counter this pass? Meathook? Flying kung fu of the underhook arm? I'm thinking even if he break the guard, the lockdown is always there for backup.
For most people, allowing your opponent to get an overhook is going to be counter-productive. For a younger student, I wouldn't suggest that she start breaking the "rules" of guard passing early on; this pass involves staying on top of them rather than posturing, and placing a hand on the mat instead of keeping your hands on your opponent's stomach. Wilson Reis is one of a very small handful of guys regularly using this style of passing with success, and he's a black belt with tons of competition experience. He has had plenty of time to develop a sensitivity and awareness that allows him to break the "rules" here and there without getting triangled/caught in an omoplata. I really believe you need to get used to playing by the rules before you can decide when/where you can judiciously break them.
btw, Marcelo preaches standing to break the guard, especially against larger and stronger opponents. After changing up my passing game to more closely resemble Marcelo's, I definitely think he's right (as usual lol).
Micah: you are right. I don't think we will be playing this type of passing. As of right now for breaking guard and passing, she's doing all of Marcelo's stuff with great success. This Sao Paulo Pass to me is too risky and I don't think she has the strength to pull it off against bigger stronger boys. And definitely she can't pull this off against any 10thplanet kids with the hand on the mat like that.
Sao Paulo Pass is prob one of my favorite passes. I normally stand to pass, but I still love this pass. If you're not good at passing half guard you will slowly get better because you won't get the pass all the time, especially against someone with good guard retention. But if you do it right, you should be able to blow by them. There are two key things you need to do, and you will see in the videos I'll post below. One, is the arm you are using to underhook/non passing side cannot be defeated or you have to start over. If they get under your arm you're screwed. Two, a good counter is for the person in guard to just switch their hips back and get you off balance. But if crush the persons hip there isn't much for them to do. Besides learning from my instructor, I took things from thee videos below to throw the way I do it together. In the Gi i dont completely underhook the person but I grab the seam under their armpit palm down then twist my hand so if I let go w/ my thumb I would give a thumbs up, it makes a tight grip. In no gi I do hug the shoulder and upper body. Always make sure to keep your head tight to their side on the passing side so it keeps everything really tight and blocks the non passing side counter by your opponent. All of these videos are in Gi, but the pass is easily transferable to no gi grips and hand placement.
http://youtu.be/35iHlelkiYE
And Tozi Pass was an early version of it http://youtu.be/KoNc7dzYv5A
http://thewilsonpass.com/ its really only for stocky strong beasts
Yeah Wilson Reis has this pass masteredQuote:
Originally Posted by Jonrivello
yeah you guys are right. Her coach, the one that like this pass is built like the HULK. He is huge and strong. No wonder it fits him so well.
i like this pass, and i use it a lot. but it takes a lot of sensitivity and awareness to get it right. and if the guard player underneath you has game from his flying kung fu, carni, etc... you're gonna run right into his traps. having said that, it can be VERY effective in the right context. just watch your base and pressure, and be ready to bail at the first sign of trouble.
Yeah. I don't think that at this moment Cora has that sensitivity yet nor does she play with enough pressure that is needed to make this effective. We're sticking with the stand up Marcelo guard break and pass. Been drilling a lot of leg drags also.
We been focusing a lot of guard break and passing and playing in the pocket so she can get comfortable there. So knows a variety of passes, but we mainly focus on blocking the hip once she pass. Her top game is coming into form. Been polishing up the North South chokes to mounted guillotine. That combo is really nice, she's loving it. Can't wait for this Sat. NAGA HOUSTON.
It would be very difficult to flying kung fu or meathook with that head and arm control. Looks like it would be pretty safe but Id have to test it out against someone that knows their rubber guard.
Just a tip, If it does get used against you, focus on the legs. Most are not good enough with the footwork to prevent halfguard if you are focused on it. Feed in that deep overhook and snag the lockdown, super stomp, butterfly, coccoon. Your right back in the drivers seat.
That's a variation of the Tozi pass. There was a video a couple years ago of another variation called the Chim pass, but that video seems to have been taken down. This can actually work very well, though it can also be tricky to execute. Sprawling out to the side kills the hips, while the combination of the far side underhook and having the head on the same side of the pass prevent the opponent from turning into you. I've used a variation with mixed results against rubber guard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7UcRuk4mog
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoNc7dzYv5A
Good stuff, imho, but far from my go to pass
Lol, should've read the whole thread :P
I know we were taught to counter the original Tozi pass to go for a head and arm choke from guard before they get the passing side arm to the other side. I used to try the original in training, but I felt like I was stacking my training partner too much so I gave up on it. I don't like doing that to my training partners, neck injuries suck. If you have a guy who is really flexible and he doesn't care it's cool I guess.
Bruce is correct. Although I'm sure the pass is mad legit, it's not a pass you wanna do on a flexible guy with a well developed rubber guard. You will find yourself in quicksand really quick :-)
a little better video in my opinionhttp://youtu.be/35iHlelkiYE
I can see this working on some guys but putting my hand on the mat just doesn't feel right.
I will say that practicing this pass vastly improved my leg trapping/slide over, and specifically, the transition from one leg to the other while maintaining solid pressure on the pinned leg. Much smoother thanks to this, and that translates to many other knee passes. If my poor description makes any sense.......