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Got to thinking, after watching some of the old Gracie challenge videos on youtube and being a former student of Kyokushin karate a question came to mind. The whole Gracie principle of getting to the ground to mount and beating an opponent this way vs the Oyama principle of I will just break you either by strikes or blocks. What is other peoples thoughts of who would win.... or does any one have videos of a kyokushin fighter (other than GSP) doing a Gracie challenge. Thoughts any1?
There is nothing hypothetical about this it was answers in the first 4 ufc's. Some people just can't let go of there karate kid dreams.
Karate without any formal grappling training, Karate loses 9.9 out of 10 times.
Id say even though I know Ill be in the minority here.. if the karate guys is good (depending on the style of karate).. He may have a key advantage over an equally as skilled (only) jiujitsu fighter. Of all of the stand-up martial arts.. Karate seems to do the best at striking from long range. Jump in, strike, jump out. This is obviously not good for someone whos hoping to get their hands on them and take them down. However, if the JJ guy has done his part on working wrestling takedowns and getting on the inside (While a skilled opponent is throwing strikes).. Then yeah the JJ guy wins almost every time. Even if you fail 5 takedown attempts.. You only have to get them down once. But it all comes down to the JJ guys takedown ability vs the Karate practitioners ability to stay away and defend takedowns. Though realistically.. Id say if youre entire style depends on being on the ground.. You will have naturally dedicated some serious time into getting people there.
I don't ever think I've seen a Gracie Challenge where the Gracie had problems taking down a non-grappler, regardless of his striking style. After that, it's always done. It doesn't matter how fast you are on your feet if you don't understand basic takedown fundamentals--If you're not sprawling, underhooking or pushing the head you're probably going down.
maybe in zero gravity the striker would be on equal "ground". If your not specifically trained to stay standing, you will be taken down.
Oyama was a very good Judoka. And Boxer! The guy was cross trained. :) Fighting all styles was his thing, he was a dojo buster like the gracies.
however, being a good grappler, and hanging with very specialized grapplers like the Gracie's are two different things.
I see lots of Dojo fights in video from the Gracies, not so many from Oyama.
However, back in the day I think Oyama would give them a serious run for their money! :D
He went to the states and fougth all challengers as well. Wrestlers, boxers, etc. (Supposedly, never seen any photos or vids of that either)
It's all very hypotethical. One thing is for certain; Gracies; bad ass mofo's! oyama; Bad ass mofo! Respect!
Edit: As for mentality, I think the best mentality is the NHB/MMA one; Be better and break the opponent in any zone. (Do as I say, not as I do) :clownface:
He fought a bull, karate chopped off its horn hispect!
Actually he fought a bunch of bulls. In Hawaii shorts. Then he took a horn to the knee.
I just re-read the question and realized you were specifically talking about Oyama vs (a?) Gracie. I thought you were just talking about the styles in general.. Yeah.. Pretty much any average Gracie wins that fight in my book. I dont know how much Oyama trained takedown defense.. But Im almost positive is not as much as the Gracies work on getting the fight to the ground
Anyone can get caught at anytime