https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EucIOqFgfMM
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At 6:55
http://www.56.com/u56/v_NzA4NjgwMjk.html
Mark Coleman taps Dan Severn. Severn out weighed him by 20 lbs.
Lemme guess , another technique that didn't pass the filter ? Cos it's not like you ever have to fight opponents who are the same size or smaller is it ? Oh wait, that happens all the time. Pfffffft
Too bad that showed it wrong. The 2nd arm comes under the shoulder, probably explains why they couldn't tap each other with it. :rolleyes:
The Gracies are kind of in "Damage Control" and a lot of the money makers in the BJJ world are getting a bit worried about the resurgance of Catch Wrestling. I have a feeling that might be one of the motives for the Sakuraba vs. Renzo fight, as they can beat him now that he is old and his body is destroyed.
That was difficult to watch. I'm very disappointed in these gentlemen. They managed to be snobby, prejudicial, self-contradictory, and dogmatic all in one relatively short video. If you're into philosophical fallacies (formal or informal), you'll get an erection watching this; it could be an instructional video for an introductory critical reasoning class. How do I love thee, o fallacy? Let me count the ways:
1. No True Scotsman – Jiu jitsu is the best martial art? What, it just got beaten? Let’s redefine “best”: it is the best at teaching the most number of people who are unathletic to kind of defend themselves unless the other person is athletic or knows catch wrestling.
2. Appeal to Probability – Jiu jitsu is more likely to help the most number of people, so it is better.
3. Denying the Antecedent – If Royce Gracie had been big, then his victories would not have been victories for jiujitsu. Royce is not big, therefore his victories are for jiujitsu.
4. Affirming a disjunct – A good martial art is one that many people can practice. Jiujitsu is an art that many people can practice, therefore all other martial arts are not.
5. Ad Hominem – Josh Barnett only won because he’s big (and bigness is a bad trait, apparently).
6. Appeal to Authority – Uncle Royce says jiujitsu is the best, so it must be. *(This is just one example; this is the most common fallacy they make.)
7. Cherry Picking – Dean Lister made the mistake of letting Josh get an overhook from side control; it wasn’t jiu jitsu’s fault. (We’re going to ignore that we’ve always trained people to get an underhook from side control, giving easy access to our head.)
8. Straw Man – Watch how I easily create a “new neck” when he tries to grab my head. (Because he’s not even actually grabbing my head.)
9. Begging the Question – Every martial art is perfect for what it is intended for. *(LoL)
10. Hasty Generalization – Jiujitsu doesn’t require strength, athleticism, etc, which all of the other martial arts do. (Ermmm… what about Taichi, for example?)
I could be here all day actually, but I’m going to go train. In jiu jitsu, in fact. I love jiu jitsu, but not for any of the above reasons.
I thought the most awful Breakdown was the one they recently did about a video of a a teenager who kills another teen with a choke. There's something terribly immoral about trying to sell a system off of a young person's death.
I really hope Sakuraba stuffs Renzo so they have to do another breakdown. My slight concern is that he is too old and dottled
Well, I'm not gonna go that far. I'd love to see a good match and don't wish ill-will on anyone, especially Renzo and his family who have gotten in the ring and/or cage, to test or rather put their money where their mouths are at. The marketing tactics of this genertions' brothers are just that. Renzo ain't got nothing to do with that.
Agreed. Renzo is on a level all of his own, nothing but respect for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiseop
My favorite post ever. All praise be to Allam!Quote:
Originally Posted by Amir Allam
They don't pass are brown belt filter for making videos... O'brian or fattywarbucks could do it better :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Herzog
That was hard to watch i just barely made it to the end of the technique portion.
I think it would be better for the development of technique in general when more people realise Gracies are not the be all end all, whatever you might think of Renzo. At least with him when he was beaten by Sakuraba before he said he was beaten by a great technician. Unlike Rickson who when speaking about Sakuraba said he wasn't a great technician. Again whatever you might think of Rickson that was just sour grapes. Well if Sakuraba is a not a good technician and he can submit the Gracies it doesn't really say much for them does it ?
I wish those guys would just stop making videos.
At 4:50 Filho dives into the same headlock against Big Nog. Both guys athletic and powerful (and pretty "pure" BJJ players as far as I know) but Big Nog outweighs him quite a bit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAPFYg676ss
I think they are nice, honest good guys but they are brainwashed from a young age to believe their grandpa was infallible and by extension the jits he taught them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Gustaveson
So true. But look who their father is, Rorion Gracie. The apples don't fall far from the tree. Rorion bought into Helio B.S. of all he needs to do is follow Helio Jiu jitsu. Like in the Rolls Gracie documentary Renzo said Rorion couldn't even compete with Rolls. It was because Rolls was evolving(cross training).
Rolls, was the man, so sad that he passed. You can for sure see the impact he had on Rickson. Rickson has that same mind set and thats what sets himself apart from those 2 knuckle heads. Crazy to think that they are the same relation to Renzo, Rickson and Kron (just to name a few). lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Jack LaBarge
Obviously they are knowledgeable however; they can be obnoxious when they claim that their family lineage gives them some magical insight into things that they may not understand i.e catch wrestling, defensive tactics with weapons, etc.
Lack of this knowledge is acceptable but, either dismissing it or claiming it to be part of the Gracie system all along is not.
This is similar to when BJJ first gained notoriety and every other martial art on the planet suddenly had a ground fighting component to their system. Which supposedly was there all along.
They are consistent though. They have a knife defense video that wreaks as bad as this one. I know this is a Jiu Jitsu forum but since I am a tactical weapons instructor, and by no means an expert in Jiu Jitsu, I have a better frame of reference for this.
Basically, the defense shown is shit and will get you killed. You cannot protect the same side regardless of the angle of attack. Unless someone lets you. Has to be a cross body defense.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNEZS_wBFt8
It was really fun when Helio got old and tired of his own BS and started saying stuff in interviews that would make Rorion's eyes bug out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack LaBarge