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Just like a bunch of people said 2 years ago, myself included, the finals rule for negative points at the start of the match ruined pretty much all the finals matches
No ground work, bad wrestling, you actually are better off getting taken down in the beginning than pulling guard
Awful
Gotta enforce the stalling calls standing
No guard pulling is a shit rule. Eddie make the sheik get rid of it
I pretty much feel asleep during the open weight final... Horrible wrestling, horrible.
We have enough matches between the last 2 events to kmow the regular round matches are much better than the finals matches
I'm yet to hear anything positive about it... Being as prestigious as the ADCC is you would think that they would be on top of things like this.
Just a side point, it's not really "horrible wrestling" even though it looks like it. It's just that 90% of "good wrestling" gets you caught in a submission against this level of opponents. I don't think wrestling that looks good to a spectator is even possible in BJJ against the highest level guys. They suck up guillotines out of nowhere.
But yea, it doesn't make for great viewing when the ruleset encourages competitors to stick to positional cautious wrestling.
The shitty thing is that I'm pretty sure the shiekh isn't really involved anymore. I don't think he's attended a live event in some time and each year a different promoter handles the details.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Smith
It's really not been as cool the past 2 times which I hate to say. I've followed every one live from 05 to now and in some ways this year was actually worse than 2013
I disagree. BJJ guys have one or two shots, have only rudimentary handfighting, and have no lateral movement to create angles. Even Galvao, successful though he was, had horrible non-level-changing shots and very sloppy finishes. Look at Rustam Chsiev to see how good wrestling looks in BJJ. Davi Ramos also looked slick.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Eddy
The ruleset is the problem. We want to see the best BJJ in the world, but the finals are always terrible because they essentially disallow ground fighting. Beyond the penalty point, judges also inexplicably care more about top position than submission attempts. So if you attack a guy from guard all day, but the match ends at 0-0, you'll lose.
As my wife put it, it is like deciding who is the best archer in the world by having a fencing match.
I disagree also... Rustam Chsiev was gettin it done. Cobrinha has good wrestling. Davi was on it. Rodolfo didn't look TOO bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Eddy
Romulo has been working his wrestling with Harmon for a WHILE and Chsiev was making him look silly standing.
Good advice and thank you for the suggestion. He does have good wrestling in BJJ. Also, why do I want to wear purple all of a sudden?Quote:
Originally Posted by Amir Allam
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUu_PN6q35Y
Good wrestling is all about the shot, reshot, level change, reshot etc. ad infinitum. Wrestlers finish the take down on their sixth attempt, not the first. This many reshots and level changes are just really dangerous in BJJ.
Sure Rustam Chsiev looks like he's doing pretty well with his wrestling, but how does it work against the actual elite? I think it's like Eddie Cummings with leg locks. If you have elite level wrestling, ok, you can make it work against most guys. At the elite level though it's just not effective.
Otavia Sousa takes Kron Gracie to overtime by completely stalling out the whole match on his feet just so he can attempt to beat Kron on takedowns. Off of Otavia's first takedown attempt Kron immediately picks up the guillotine and subs him. This kind of thing just messes up good wrestling. You have to be able to play around. Fake, fake, fake, shot, reshot, level change etc. You can't do that when you have a monster like Kron able to suck up a guillotine out of the slightest mistake.
Wrestling is about aggression. Hesitance ruins good wrestling.
The most effective wrestling in BJJ at the elite levels would be Marcelo's in my opinion. He has honed in on a very simple and very consistent takedown for himself. Armdrag to the single leg. There's no first shot, second shot, level change, fake etc. It's simple and consistent.
That's what I see at least. And it's what I feel from attempting wrestling other BJJ guys as I wrestled for 8 or so years before BJJ and now use practically none of it. I use to think these guys are terrible at wrestling, now I just think the key elements to good wrestling are just too dangerous to use in BJJ.
Basically, this is a different sport and you have to play it differently. "Wrestling" as most people thing of it, isn't getting it done consistently at the high levels of grappling. But then again, very few things are working consistently at that level. That said, I feel like you have the right idea with it needing to be basically another art of takedowns entirely. Like GSP could take down everyone in MMA but people with arguably better "wrestling" struggled to get anywhere near the same results.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Eddy
I also would like to see some rule tweaks in ADCC to create more exiting matches, but I doubt it will happen. That said, Cummings made 20k at EBI and 1st at ADCC would be worth only 10k to him.... with only 1.4k added if you got match of the night too. So since prestige usually follows the cash, we might have the much more exiting EBI's to look forward to in the future as THE prestige tournament out there.
Spot on! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Debes
In Sub Grappling... Good wrestling is about the set up and hand fighting. Yes, being able to Chain Wrestle is key inside the wrestling arena.
In Sub Grappling is posture, position, hand fighting and set ups to get that one attack and finish it.
I agree with this. In wrestling, you are way less likely to get pinned while chain wrestling that submitted in jiu jitsu. So, wrestlers that have adapted well to bjj know when to bail out and don't over extend themselves chasing 2 at the risk of being submitted and losing the match.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Baldwin
I've seen lots of very good wrestlers struggle in BJJ because, for whatever reason, they can't let go of that determination to finish the takedown with chain wrestling, and that often leads them deep into a trap.