Fantastic fuckin fight!!! Big props to both fighters!
Printable View
Fantastic fuckin fight!!! Big props to both fighters!
yeah it was really good and the winner is... Clay Guida!!!
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah aha i knew he would beat pettis
Who won for the contract?
AMAZING jiujitsu, BEST fight of the night handsdown
Pettis had some pretty crazy kicks though
Ransey Nijem lost by 1st round ko.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent E.
I'm not happy with the way this fight went. Guida got credit for takedowns that completely offset how out of his depth he was on the ground with Pettis, not to mention that it was clearly Pettis who had the upper hand on the feet as well.
I just don't understand how so much emphasis can be placed on a takedown when Pettis was on the offensive going for submissions the entire time, and Guida couldn't pass his guard to save his life.
Octagon control- GuidaQuote:
Originally Posted by Nick Powers
Agression- Guida
Effective striking- Pettis was more flashy but guida landed more hard/solid shots fore the sake of argument ill give it to Pettis
Takedowns-Guida
Grapiling-tie... for the sake of argument ill give it to pettis
It all just boils down to Guida doing more damage and being more effective, Guida set his takedowns up with striking wicth i thought was fantastic.
Guida won the fight... I wish this fight was 5 rounds i know dana said that they are gonna start doing 5 round fights at the end of 2011 but they should of made this the first non-title 5 round fight maybe the outcome would of been different...
I knew that Guida had won but let's be honest. Guida was in way more trouble throughout the fight than Pettis was.
yes guida won, and the way fights are judged i agree he won
But thats the problem with mma judging today, far to much emphasis is placed on the guy on top, guida did nothing from the top today, he couldn't pass pettis's guard, i think i could had counted on one hand the number of effective strikes he landed from it, and pettis worked his ass off, going from one thing to another, he just couldn't catch him, and hence he lost...
still a very good fight, but showtime made it a good fight, guida worked for the win, and he thats what he's paid to do!
So, how about this question. Do you get more points for failed submission attempts, or getting out of or protecting yourself from the submissions? As mentioned in a post above, Guida landed more shots, and took down Pettis numerous times. Are you saying that Pettis should have won because he had submission ATTEMPTS?
Final point. If it were judged as a JJ match, Guida would have won on points.
Terrific fight. I was pullin for Pettis the whole time. He's a young kid with so much potential. Just gotta keep that posture broken when lockin up that triangle. Damn...ya had 4 chances at it...live an learn...I bet he fixes that mistake in his next fight.
I wasn't going to say anything but I couldn't understand how he could set up the triangle perfectly and then let go of his posture. that's triangle 101 stuff right there. grab the back of the head or overhook the arm or both at least until your legs are locked. so frustrating!Quote:
Originally Posted by VJ Bella
IN the words of Eddie Bravo.......If you cannot finish the dude from your back, you have to sweep. I think that if Pettis had tried for a sweep amongst his attack to vary the fight, he just might have achieved at least more top position or opened up the base of Guida to finish him there. If you cannot finish or sweep, then your pretty much losing the fight no matter how strongly you feel about it, and that's exactly what happened!
Duke Roufus has a Purple Belt running his JJ program and Duke fired his Wrestling coach, who was teaching for free.... I don't know what else to say. Not taking anything away from Purple belts btw... I expected the grappling side of the fighters to dwindle down @ Roufusport... Anthony Pettis is a friend of mine and I feel bad that he lost. I honestly think he can beat Guida if he had a better grappling program in his kitchen.
I agree, Pettis did the exact same wrist control > triangle setup he has done since day 1. Stayed flat on his back in half guard, never tried to load a butterfly hook while in half guard when there was tremendous space, only reason I say this instead of trying to get on his side is... I don't think anybody would really want to be in Clay Guida's head arm control - that guy was squeezing tight and wouldn't let go for nothing. Anthony Pettis does have a decent Mission Control, I have no idea why he doesn't use it... all them elbows that could happen...Quote:
Originally Posted by FRANK BARCA
Guida was only stuck in 1 submission that was deep, Where else was he in trouble?Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Camacho
AgreedQuote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Piper
Yeah Guida deffo won the fight but yeah, I think they should take into account what the guy on top is doing, wrestlers will pin thier opponent down and beat on them and rightfully so get scored on it, but a guy sat in guard throwing the odd short punch now and then shouldnt be getting scored more than a guy constantly attacking for submissions
lame lay-n-pray win again.. and that's why I NEVER buy a UFC event filled with wrestlers. Its good if you want a good sleeping pill thou. Clay-n-Pray Guida.... LOL. Hope someone brutaly knocks him to retirement, cant stand this grosse "fighter".
I honestly found Clays ground game very good and entertaining... His submission defenses were really good, nice posture when it was needed. Really stood up to Anthony's flexible guard. Nevermind the dissapointment in wrestling... I was more dissapointed in the Jiu Jitsu work. An entertaining game to me doesn't have to be an aggressive crazy triangle thrown in the air, but can be someone answering 8 crazy triangles throw in the air... It was intelligent.
I think what we are beginning to see is that if you're only going to go for triangles from guard and that's the extent of your submission game; strong, well-trained fighters will defend them all day, when that's basically all they are expecting.
Guida didn't have qualms about leaving one arm in because he was sitting all the way back and knew Pettis was going to shoot for triangles. His closest sub of the night by far was when we switched to attacking the arm.
Having to hault your offense in order to dodge multiple triangles is a drastic momentum shift for the guard. Even per the NSAC judging criteria, that would score the guard for pettis. But judges don't score that way so I don't expect them to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Piper
Guida won the fight with respect to current MMA ruling and judging. According to my personal way of looking at a fight, which does not matter to anyone but myself, he did not win the fight, just mighty mouse against torres did not win. I do not think a wrestler taking his opponent down and not getting submitted as a proper way to win a fight. Also how the hell was guida more agressive? Do you guys judge the guy who gets take downs as more aggressive? All guida did from the top was shake his hair all over the place accompanied with some spastic cage movement.
The criteria for judging are, strikes landed, take downs, octagon control and aggression. Well it seems like if you get a takedown and manage to stay on top you get the take down, octagon control and aggression parts already. Wrestler gets 3 out of 4 categories, Striker gets 1 out f 4 category and the BJJ player gets no category. Only way he can win is by submission, there is no way he can win by decision because the position that he is very comfortable in is assumed by others as he is losing immensely.
Do you get points for blocking a punch? I'm up for seeing submission specialist and not submission attempt specialist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Daniels
ThisQuote:
Originally Posted by Steven Daniels
I wish all Main or Co-Main event fights were 5 rounds.
But you can only finish one submission per fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Piper
Is a submission (or a submissions attempt) worthless if it doesn't finish a fight? By that logic a takedown is worth even less than a submission attempt since one leads to the other. The only practical value (not real world mma judge value) of a takedown is that it lands you in a position from which you can strike, submit, or transition to a more dominant position. Even by the NSAC judging criteria the guard is regarded as a neutral position.
As for if it were a JJ match, of course Guida would win. That's because the old adage of "position before submission" is the gold standard of logic by which most BJJ rules are based around. But sports grappling has the same problem, where insincere grapplers game the system to hold people for gains in points. Just more instances of wanting to win the game rather than the fight.
Keep in mind here, at no point have I ever stated that Pettis should have won. I understand, just as Pettis did, the rules of the game he was playing. Clearly he lost.
I thought it was one of the best fight nights I've seen. really enjoyed the card! and guida vs. pettis was very entertaining. though, i can't say that it didn't take away from my experience when i realized guida went in looking for a decision win:(
Now that is what i call a fight. I wished it had 2 more rounds.
Agree with the opinion that "Guida was in way more trouble throughout the fight than Pettis was."
Nonetheless great fight from both fighters!
Pettis landed one sweep, maybe. He had room for butterfly a lot of the time on the ground.
And a final point. Guida outlanded Pettis:
http://blog.fightmetric.com/2011/06/...tatistics.html
Hey, you and me watched the same fight! Awesome.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Daniels
Ideally the unified MMA rules would structure its point system to award the decision to whatever fighter would win in a real fight with no rounds, no time-limits & no points. Obviously we don't have those fights due to time constraints but that is what we all really want to know, isn't it?
I don't want to know who can come up with the best game-plan to win a game. I want to believe in the UFC's 'as-real-as-it-gets' hype. I want to know who can kick who's ass in the real world, that's it.
With the shit system in place now we find that elite wrestlers, like Guida, can hold the top positions for 3 rounds despite not having the skills to finish. Clearly Guida won more points on the mat & on his feet - but yet we all could smell that Guida was not going to submit or KO Pettis. I believe Pettis would eventually have won but who knows, maybe he would have gassed in round 7 & been overcome by the Labowski-juggernaut that is Clay Guida.
I don't like the system they have now because it results in a lot of bad calls but this wasn't one of them. Even though I think Pettis would have eventually won I can't think of a point system that could possibly award Pettis the victory. In Torres case last week he was robbed by the shitty point system. Active guard, more effective strikes, elbows from the bottom - he should have won & could have with a better rule system.
The sad thing is that there appears to be no real push to change the system - even though it gets bitched about thoroughly every 2-4 weeks after a card that ends in some really bad decisions.
It looked pretty one sided to me 30-27 is not a great fight
guys....I know I am a ground newb...but that fight was unwatcheable and I can't take it. This is the lay n pray point sparring and it makes me wanna throw up. I'm sorry. We had Clay on top HOLDING position making very little effort to try to win the fight. I know I know...Pettis should train to combat wrestlers, but this looked exactly like a Fitch fight. I never thought I would see this from clay. I love the ground...but let's have some work down there....
Guida did not intend to hold position; Pettis had wrist control most of the time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Davis
^^^Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Daniels
just because pettis had wrist control, doesn't mean guida would've tried to pass or do anything else anyways. in all his other matches, he's always content with holding people down in someones guard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Daniels