Armbar ankles, Crossed or not?

Armbars are my number one gi and no gi submission. Concerning the armbar from mount/side control ( with both legs over the opponent) do you guys like to cross your ankles? Do you pinch you knees? I ask because Ronda Rousey, Roger Gracie, and both Mendes brothers cross their ankles and flare out their knees when they go for this armbar. I have had many people tell me to never cross your ankles and to pinch your knees. What do you guys think?

Heres ronda doing this. The best example is about 30 seconds in.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5Iyuo9Kvy0s

I have never heard say when the ankles are crossed to flare out the knees, I've seen people do, but I think that's just a mistake in the heat of the battle. We always cross the ankles and squeeze the knees. I find this locks the far shoulder (along with controlling the legs in full spider web), making it extremely difficult to escape.

Cross them when you are on top in spiderweb, with the knees tight. Dont cross then on bottom in guard, just leg curl. My two cents ;)

I thought it was a mistake too, but Ronda says that she does it on purpose. (So does Roger, but i cant find that video). Here is Ronda saying why she does it.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=geHcVtcYkHE

Shigeki told me once (the one time I rolled with him) that the leg (ankle) over torso should be on top of leg (ankle) over the head. So that when you straighten the leg that is over the head, the back of your knee now pushes down on his head because it now pivots off the other ankle. And constantly squeeze the knees. (Pivot may be the wrong word).

My favorite Renato clip right there lol

The way she dose it is kinda like flattening your knees while in the truck or lock down. Very interesting indeed.

We teach new folk not to cross the ankles when doing the arm bar to help them understand that they need to create pressure on the opponent, particularly the head. If you cross, you make sure your leg that's over the head/neck is under the one over the torso. Whether the knees flare out or not is secondary to the pressure down on the opponent and the pinching done to the arm. Ronda, for example, IS pinching the arm with her hamstrings/butt. Just do it right now: cross your legs and straighten them: see how you could hold a penny between there if you had too? :) Pinching the knees accomplishes the same thing but with the top of our legs/upper crotch area.

There's the basic swing in baseball you teach all little leaguers. Then you see someone like Panda Sandoval get up there messing up all the rules and coaches gotta scramble to explain to their players that dudes' a major leaguer.

Edit: I don't cross my ankles unless it's the arm bar that follows a defended triangle choke from guard. Just my preference.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aiseop

We teach new folk not to cross the ankles when doing the arm bar to help them understand that they need to create pressure on the opponent, particularly the head. If you cross, you make sure your leg that's over the head/neck is under the one over the torso. Whether the knees flare out or not is secondary to the pressure down on the opponent and the pinching done to the arm. Ronda, for example, IS pinching the arm with her hamstrings/butt. Just do it right now: cross your legs and straighten them: see how you could hold a penny between there if you had too? :) Pinching the knees accomplishes the same thing but with the top of our legs/upper crotch area.

There's the basic swing in baseball you teach all little leaguers. Then you see someone like Panda Sandoval get up there messing up all the rules and coaches gotta scramble to explain to their players that dudes' a major leaguer.

Edit: I don't cross my ankles unless it's the arm bar that follows a defended triangle choke from guard. Just my preference.

---

So you're saying we SHOULD cross our ankles. Like Ronda Rousey. Right?

;)

Honestly if you watch high level elite grapplers, they tend to cross their ankles most of the time, despite what it taught. I think it doesn't usually matter. There are more important details to focus on with the armbar I think. If you follow some other key principles then it doesn't matter too much if the ankles are crossed or not.

Yes, keep everything tight. When in Spiderweb (Top armbar position while controlling leg with one arm) cross feet south over north under opponents far shoulder for greater control (can prevent corkscrew escape - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIvdU00BdtU ) But when on bottom don't cross feet.


They talk about this in a Gracie breakdown

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zd9wbqZgsL8 --- at 5:30

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50i_L...42jHrmmzayFEeg --- at 13:30

Spiderweb philosophy and examples

http://www.10thplanetjj.com/techniqu...36-dead-zones/ -starts 37:00

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na0xoegVfc8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gYkFEtCPAI

Im constantly pinching squeezing curling pressing all the damn time in spiderweb. Adds so much pressure to their defence of the arm thats being attacked. Sometimes that arm pops out just out of my doing those things all the time. Its hard work to hold on defending and trying to get to your knees!, Its Tough to do all those things as well, all the time, but tell me? Whats easy in Jiu jitsu anyway? Bottom line? If you are wanting your game to be able to be battle ready against bigger and stronger athletes, then do everything you can, all at the same time, to affect maximum effectiveness in the spiderweb. If you leave anything out? Then that probably shows your level. And thats fine too......so practice! Perfectly:cool: