Whipping up someone way heavier in half guard ?

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02-12-2012, 11:19 AM
Ironsal

Whipping up someone way heavier in half guard ?

I was Rolling with this 20 year old Sambo guy (i am just 13) and he weighs WAY more than i do, at least a 60 lbs diference, we started and he went quick and pinned me on a wall and went for a slam, he was in side-control , i succesfuly transitioned to half guard and got the Lockdown, i had both underhooks but i couldnt Whip up ! he was Way heavier than me, so we just stayed there in half guard till it was over !
So is there a way to whip up someone way heavier than you ? and if no then what type of half guard to play when someone Heavy is on you ?
Thanks guys, this is my first post in the Nibiru Forum !
02-12-2012, 11:31 AM
Will Thaxton

Find a video of the thumbs up tech Coah Alder teaches. Sometimes it's not just one motion. You inch by inch move out. Try to move him but also scoot your own butt out. When it takes a long time to get on your side be ready for forearms in your neck. Squeeze those double unders.
02-12-2012, 11:37 AM
Ironsal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will Thaxton

Find a video of the thumbs up tech Coah Alder teaches. Sometimes it's not just one motion. You inch by inch move out. Try to move him but also scoot your own butt out. When it takes a long time to get on your side be ready for forearms in your neck. Squeeze those double unders.

What is the "thumbs up tech Coah Alder teaches" and it seems i found nothing about it on the net !
could you post a link for more help.
02-12-2012, 12:41 PM
David Stager

http://www.lockflow.com/grappling-te...ip-new-version

I've heard it called the fat man whip-up too.
02-12-2012, 12:45 PM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will Thaxton

Sometimes it's not just one motion. You inch by inch move out. Try to move him but also scoot your own butt out.

+1 If he's not moving, trying getting to your side with him on top of you. Just as true for the whip down.
02-12-2012, 12:49 PM
Ironsal

Dude thanks ! this really helps , and its easy to go to Electric chair from there, just what i need to do when i roll with him again !
Any other suggestions ?
02-12-2012, 12:58 PM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Stager

I've heard it called the fat man whip-up too.

Scratch that. It seems that the fat man whip-up was coined by Ari Bolden and is different from the thumbs up whip-up. He demonstrates it toward the end of this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=js8mzRrcKs0
02-12-2012, 01:02 PM
Ari Bolden

Zog is actually the guy who has the best version of the whip up for big dudes. I stole his technique (I simply call it the PIMP ARM whip up). It is the inch by inch movement mentioned above.
02-12-2012, 01:08 PM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ironsal

Any other suggestions ?

Whip down (sometimes called the whip back). Let's say you normally whip up to your right side. Well, the whip down is the opposite, so you end up on your left side. From there you can try for the "Five O" Sweep, or if you can free your head from his left arm, you can go for the electric chair again. MTS episode 4, 21:44 demonstrates the Five O Sweep, episode 15, 2:19 demonstrates a heel hook from the whip down, but Eddie mentions the electric chair as an option (in case heel hooks aren't allowed).
02-12-2012, 01:11 PM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ari Bolden

Zog is actually the guy who has the best version of the whip up for big dudes. I stole his technique (I simply call it the PIMP ARM whip up). It is the inch by inch movement mentioned above.

I had a 250 lbs guy in my lockdown the other day, and I wish I had thought to use the pimp arm as you suggest.
02-12-2012, 01:13 PM
DBK

you can use the einstein whip up move where he puts 1 arm up, i forgot the name. its pretty easy to do.
02-12-2012, 01:28 PM
Ironsal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ari Bolden

Zog is actually the guy who has the best version of the whip up for big dudes. I stole his technique (I simply call it the PIMP ARM whip up). It is the inch by inch movement mentioned above.

Any video TO that ? and by the way who is ZOg ? (really need the vid)
02-12-2012, 01:51 PM
Chris Herzog

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ironsal

Any video TO that ? and by the way who is ZOg ? (really need the vid)

That'd be me ;)

..... I got the Fat Whip from Brent Littel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhSUrKIM3FM
02-12-2012, 05:30 PM
AJ Camacho

Try to remember too, that the whole goal of the whip up is to get onto your side. Whipping somebody up and then bringing them back down on top of you doesn't do anything. Sometimes people let me get to my side and other times I have to scrape and grind for every inch just to gain an angle to get onto my hip.
02-12-2012, 05:32 PM
Brandon Mccaghren

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Stager

http://www.lockflow.com/grappling-te...ip-new-version

I've heard it called the fat man whip-up too.

Who's that handsome devil?

http://www.pajiba.com/assets_c/2011/...x258-23076.jpg
02-12-2012, 05:35 PM
David Rosado

Yeah, that fat whip is good money if you're against a heavier guy. Good for me because I have the weight of a 230lbs guy, with the strength of say a 170'er. So this helps a lot.
02-12-2012, 06:14 PM
Bill Keeling

There is a mountain of knowledge already stated. But to understand the movement itself helps a lot. First rep it a few times with someone your size. Whip up (make sure your hips come off the floor) and stop there. Feel how much control you have over his base. I find too many people are not fully incorporating their hips when whipping up, or down ;) just a small detail I hope it helps!
02-12-2012, 07:09 PM
David Rosado

Thanks Bill.
02-12-2012, 07:58 PM
Bill Keeling

No thanks needed David! Happy to help when I can, and learn when I can't ;)
02-14-2012, 04:38 PM
Alder Hampel

I prefer to not whip up at all if possible. Whipping up means I'm flat on my back, a position I NEVER want to be in against a larger opponent. One of the newer ways I try to get my half guard is, by controlling the distance, and pulling my lockdown/half guard already on my side.

Maybe I'll post if on my email list if there's enough interest.
02-14-2012, 06:38 PM
Greg W

I've been using the shoulder clamp grip for years now on bigger guys in my HG game. I had this problem before all this great info on the web, so I tried to find a solution on my own. It is just starting to be effective for me. I'll try to explain: I clamp grip on the shoulder like you are going for a straight arm bar from Full guard. I torgue and whip up(as best you can) the HG while driving the opponents shoulder (and face) to the mat. The more you roll the shoulder the better. During this, I roll to my hip/shoulder and scoot my butt out. If you keep what would be your pimp arm elbow tucked into your chest during the clamp, you should be able to pull it back down when you release the clamp for the perfect doubles. Sometimes if I clamp real good and start to slide it down the arm I can really pressure for a straight arm and get the person to try and free their arm over my head, I let them and take the back. Sometimes they posture and pull their arm straight out, I then dive for the old school sweep or electric chair if they base out with the free leg. The real trick is just getting enough space to pass your pimp arm up past his shoulder to get the clamp grip. You'll be amazed how much control you have with a lockdown and a shoulder clamp. Just my 2cents for all the skinny guys(girls) that are sick of the fat dude just laying on them...
02-14-2012, 11:09 PM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alder Hampel

I prefer to not whip up at all if possible. Whipping up means I'm flat on my back, a position I NEVER want to be in against a larger opponent. One of the newer ways I try to get my half guard is, by controlling the distance, and pulling my lockdown/half guard already on my side.

Maybe I'll post if on my email list if there's enough interest.

I would be very interested in a breakdown of something like this. Are you pulling half guard and then going to the lockdown, or can you pull directly into the lockdown?
02-15-2012, 07:34 AM
muhammad_shazlee

I'm the smallest in my class, I'm 15 whenever I'm in half guard and I can't whip I go straight to super stomp
02-15-2012, 07:52 AM
David Rosado

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alder Hampel

I prefer to not whip up at all if possible. Whipping up means I'm flat on my back, a position I NEVER want to be in against a larger opponent. One of the newer ways I try to get my half guard is, by controlling the distance, and pulling my lockdown/half guard already on my side.

Maybe I'll post if on my email list if there's enough interest.

How can we convince you? I'm interested. Start a thread?
02-15-2012, 09:45 AM
Greg W

Do you super stomp from double unders? They pass right away on me. I only super stomp with the over/under because of this. Do you just move your hands down and control the hips like a double pimp arm?
02-15-2012, 09:51 AM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg W

Do you super stomp from double unders? They pass right away on me. I only super stomp with the over/under because of this. Do you just move your hands down and control the hips like a double pimp arm?

Yeah, it seems like a waste of double underhooks to stomp.
02-15-2012, 09:52 AM
Greg W

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alder Hampel

I prefer to not whip up at all if possible. Whipping up means I'm flat on my back, a position I NEVER want to be in against a larger opponent. One of the newer ways I try to get my half guard is, by controlling the distance, and pulling my lockdown/half guard already on my side.

Maybe I'll post if on my email list if there's enough interest.

This works well, really well for me with guys within 20lbs of me. Bigger guys still seem to roll and flatten me as I slide in before I get the perfect doubles locked. I end up flat on my back with the lockdown. Advice!
02-15-2012, 10:01 AM
David Stager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg W

This works well, really well for me with guys within 20lbs of me. Bigger guys still seem to roll and flatten me as I slide in before I get the perfect doubles locked. I end up flat on my back with the lockdown. Advice!

Maybe use the momentum of them trying to flatten you to whip down. If you can get to your side on a whip down, double underhooks are easy to come by.
02-15-2012, 10:22 AM
Greg W

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Stager

Maybe use the momentum of them trying to flatten you to whip down. If you can get to your side on a whip down, double underhooks are easy to come by.

yeh, did see Eddie demostrate that and push in the persons arm pit. Going to refresh with video and I'll try that more tonight. Good advice.