Is this guy legit, or a con artist?

So, a friend of mine took a few classes at a gym in San Jose, CA, and wanted my opinion on whether it was a good place to stay. I looked it up, and found a website, but there was no info on where the instructor learned. Then I went to yelp reviews, and became concerned when every review was either one star or five. They all either said "Tom is amazing, this is the best gym ever," or "I have never had a worse experience" (link to long, elaborate review below). So then I called him, and got a ... weird response. When I asked where he got his belt or who he trained with, he asked, "What kind of a question is that?" When I explained that how he teaches, his style of game, and what teams he has worked with are all different depending on where he learned, and that I meant no disrespect, he said, "People don't ask me questions like that. But I got my brown belt from the 'Gracies' (none named in particular)", and then mumbled some vague other names inaudibly, and then said he "moved to Pitbull" (presumably a black belt who promoted him to black).

Needless to say, there were some warning bells. Plus, this one yelp review made it sound EXTREMELY bad. But before I jump to conclusions, I wanted to see if anyone knows this guy. It's possible he just got a bad review, and is not good on the phone. I know that some traditional Brazilians can be tough to deal with at first, but it doesn't mean they are not legit. So, has anyone trained with him, seen his gym, heard of him, etc? Anyone from the San Jose area? The name is Tom Cissero, his website is http://cbjj.net/, and his yelp is http://www.yelp.com/biz/cissero-braz...jitsu-san-jose (see 1-star review).

Thanks!

Ive heard of Pitbull jj but it was also from someone that it was difficult to find a lineage. If I got those kinds of responses and they would be some major red flags and probably wouldn't go to the gym. If your lineage is solid you don't respond with a "what kind of question is that?".

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Originally Posted by Harry Evans

So, a friend of mine took a few classes at a gym in San Jose, CA, and wanted my opinion on whether it was a good place to stay. I looked it up, and found a website, but there was no info on where the instructor learned. Then I went to yelp reviews, and became concerned when every review was either one star or five. They all either said "Tom is amazing, this is the best gym ever," or "I have never had a worse experience" (link to long, elaborate review below). So then I called him, and got a ... weird response. When I asked where he got his belt or who he trained with, he asked, "What kind of a question is that?" When I explained that how he teaches, his style of game, and what teams he has worked with are all different depending on where he learned, and that I meant no disrespect, he said, "People don't ask me questions like that. But I got my brown belt from the 'Gracies' (none named in particular)", and then mumbled some vague other names inaudibly, and then said he "moved to Pitbull" (presumably a black belt who promoted him to black).

Needless to say, there were some warning bells. Plus, this one yelp review made it sound EXTREMELY bad. But before I jump to conclusions, I wanted to see if anyone knows this guy. It's possible he just got a bad review, and is not good on the phone. I know that some traditional Brazilians can be tough to deal with at first, but it doesn't mean they are not legit. So, has anyone trained with him, seen his gym, heard of him, etc? Anyone from the San Jose area? The name is Tom Cissero, his website is http://cbjj.net/, and his yelp is http://www.yelp.com/biz/cissero-braz...jitsu-san-jose (see 1-star review).

Thanks!

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Hey man I have friends that have trained with that tool bag, and he is basically overcharging for some purple belt level Jiu Jitsu, tell your buddy if he's in that area just go to AKA or Ralph Gracie's in Mountain View. Or if he's more in our neck of the woods, Rocha BJJ on Grand Ave in Oakland. Or he willing to make a commute hit up Denny's place in San Francisco. Pitbull Jiu Jitsu is crap.

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Originally Posted by Kyle Spalla

Hey man I have friends that have trained with that tool bag, and he is basically overcharging for some purple belt level Jiu Jitsu, tell your buddy if he's in that area just go to AKA or Ralph Gracie's in Mountain View. Or if he's more in our neck of the woods, Rocha BJJ on Grand Ave in Oakland. Or he willing to make a commute hit up Denny's place in San Francisco. Pitbull Jiu Jitsu is crap.

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Hey Kyle, great advice! I am a blue belt under Eduardo (Rocha JJ), and I train there almost every day. It's the best training I have ever found. As a matter of fact, if you are the Kyle I think you are, then we know each other pretty well, lol. I'm the lanky white boy who actually plays rubber guard in a gi.

I watched some youtube videos of those guys training, and it looked like a complete joke. So did that guy's technique videos. Seriously hilarious. I just wanted to make sure, before I spoke poorly of the guy, so thanks!

Yeah I have been through Eduardo's a few times, dude is intense, and I like how he incorporates the Grey Belt into his ranking systems, which I hear a lot of schools are doing now. I have a buddy named Nathan Brown that trains there or at least he did. I thought about going back there and officially signing up but not sure since he is a Royler black belt if he wants anything to do with 10pjj guys. He and looks like the fiercely loyal type and so does Xande, and I wouldn't fuck with either lol.

Gym looks nice, but if he gives you douchebag respones and doesn't answer your question, then FUCK HIM!!!

The simple fact he said his instructor lineage was "one of the Gracie's" and he not only can't tell you which one but the fact that he isn't an affiliate of that Gracie just screams bullshit.

All legit black belts are proud of their lineage and are just waiting to talk about it with anybody who gives a damn to ask. Anybody who skirts around the issue of their lineage is a fraud.

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When I asked where he got his belt or who he trained with, he asked, "What kind of a question is that?" When I explained that how he teaches, his style of game, and what teams he has worked with are all different depending on where he learned, and that I meant no disrespect, he said, "People don't ask me questions like that.

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Arn't most people exciting and happy to talk about their lineage? I can't wait to tell people I train under a student of master eddies and my lineage goes through Josh passini, to eddie, and in origins to jean jaques, I can hardly hold that in let alone take offense to someone asking me it...

The ONLY reason someone is going take offense is:
A- Their credentials are fake, inflated, or given to them by someone's who were, or is just not legit, or a known mcdojo teacher.
B- They have had a falling out with their origins, so that makes it sensitive to discuss.
C- They think the person asking has motivations that are negative; eg he thinks people have a negative opinion of where he trained and thinks they are setting up the question to go further into that, something i've experienced with people asking me about 10th planet before.

I looked on the site out of curiosity and it says that he go his knowledge of JJ from Pitbull JJ founder Adilson “Bitta” Lima who is a 6th degree BB. It doesn't say that he got a BB from him it only says Lima passed on his knowledge to him. This could mean anything. It is pretty carefully worded. I also looked up this Lima character and it says he is affiliated with Renzo.

http://cbjj.net/training/brazilian-jiu-jitsu/

1st off I've never herd of this (alledged) BB in pitbull jj! I'm a brown belch under Bruce Weiler a real 2nd degree BB under Bitta and he's totally legit Homie's! Marco Nascimento is his Head instructor in the US at Peninsula JJ go check it out in foster city Cali totally legit! I'll ask if my instructor ever herd of him cause he goes out there 3 to 4 times a year! sounds like a fake chump who's internet trained and attended a seminar and self promoted himself!

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Originally Posted by josh sullivan

sounds like a fake chump who's internet trained and attended a seminar and self promoted himself!

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I'm can't believe in this day and age of a more educated consumer base when it comes to BJJ and/or MMA, that people STILL try to fraudulently represent themselves to make the sale. Every single purple, brown, black....hell...even blue belt is usually EXTREMELY proud of their belt lineage and will give you 2, 3, or even 4 generations of their belt lineage should you bring up the topic. I'd bring down the awareness hammer on this guy. I guess where there's money involved......

Alright I am stationed in San Jose, I get off leave Monday it's time to pay this duchebag a visit. I am a brown belt in Judo under David Quinonez, 4th degree black belt under Wally Jay the founder of Small Circle Jujitsu.

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Originally Posted by Kyle Spalla

4th degree black belt under Wally Jay the founder of Small Circle Jujitsu.

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You should talk with Gonzo (username: Otomi) and Derek Stewart...they are both black belts as well. I think Gonzo is a 6th degree if I remember correctly.

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Originally Posted by AJ Camacho

All legit black belts are proud of their lineage and are just waiting to talk about it with anybody who gives a damn to ask. Anybody who skirts around the issue of their lineage is a fraud.

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That is the simple truth.

reminded me of this:



http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lr...l23oo1_400.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdotu...eature=related

Tom Cissero is legit, but he's a hit or miss type of guy. You love his instruction or you hate it.

In 2010 we (BS.Net) were investigating a BJJ fraud. That fraud gave a "Tom Cicero" as being the one that promoted him to black belt. Unfortunally there exists no "Tom Cicero" and for a period of time a lot of sites (incl. BS.Net and Sherdog) took contact up with the real Tom Cissero, who had absolutely nothing to do with the fraud.

But you have to understand that if you are being telephoned and asked if you promoted a known fraud to black belt, while running your own school...well, it will make you cautious of every call where they ask for your lineage.

There are other BJJ schools in that district, so give your friend the advice to train there.

Hope that this helps.

Thanks for the background, guys. Rene, that post would explain a lot. Also Kyle, Eduardo is very open to students from any background. He can seem judgmental about other approaches to BJJ (like 10th planet), but that's just a mix of his traditional background and his tough demeanor. He gives me minor shit for playing RG all the time - but then he shows me how to adjust my omaplata as I set it up through chill dog to keep it tight. That's just how he is. You won't find him teaching a class on defending the whip up, but everyone teaches a different style anyway. I still think overall he runs the best team I have ever trained with (I haven't really trained extensively with any 10th planet teams, so I can say that without feeling bad).

If you still are interested, I would try signing up. You can either downplay the 10th planet background, or go the other direction. Try saying, "I've spent some time training with a no-gi focus at 10th Planet SF, but I'm interested in doing some gi work and learning to add another style of BJJ to my game. I am very open minded to different styles, but I just waned to make sure that you don't mind that I have trained with some other teams." I think this would work best. There really isn't too much rivalry in the sense of "Well, Eddie beat my master Royler, so I hate anyone who ever trained there." It's more just a difference in techniques and approach.

One more thing. There is a new gym opening up in San Leandro called Machine Works BJJ. The owner and teacher is Jeremy Adkins, who earned his black belt from Eduardo Rocha. Jeremy is a great teacher I have trained with for years, and his legitimacy as both fighter and coach is off the charts. This is a guy who is used to winning large tournaments practically every time he competes, and knows how to systematically break down a move or a position with a lot of reasons why, and very little "the hand just goes here." I can't vouch for him enough.

Jeremy's main goal is to provide affordable BJJ to your average person. He thinks BJJ has gotten too pricey, and his mantra of "working man's jiu-jitsu" shows as much in his technique as it does in his business practices. If you want to check out another amazing spot, just stop in, I know he is very open to ALL TYPES of BJJ. He has nothing against 10th Planet, or Eddie, or 50-50, or any other ideas people come up with, and is always trying to learn from his students while he teaches them. You won't find any rivalry BS there.

Anyway, his site, number, and address are below. Check him out, and tell him Harry told you to. We train together all the time, and this way maybe we can get him to start jumping on the forum as well. He is a great resource.

Jeremy Adkins
Machine Works BJJ
http://machineworksbjj.com/
http://machineworksjiujitsu.blogspot.com/
689 E. 14th St., San Leandro CA 94577
510-686-0116

I found this thread randomly and thought I would share some facts to clear up a lot of misinformation in this thread.

Tom Cicero trained under Ralph Gracie and Batata at least until purple belt in Mountain View. I'm not sure where he received his brown or black belts. He could've received his brown from Ralph, but I can't confirm since I left Ralph's by then. He was there the same time as many of the Ralph Gracie black belts teaching in San Jose today, including Dave Camarillo, Mike Prudencio (AKA, One World), Alex Kahnbabian (AKA).

He also trained under Adilson Bita Lima (soon 7th degree) and Marco Nascimento (5th degree) for a period of time (maybe a year?). Tom did not receive a black belt from either Bita or Marco and is not part of Pitbull BJJ.

Pitbull BJJ is legit. Bita has over 120 black belts (almost all in Teresopolis, Brazil), including many world champions.

Bita is the founder of Pitbull BJJ and Marco (Bita's first black belt) runs Pitbull BJJ in the US. Both are insanely legit. Anyone questioning Bita's or Pitbull's legitimacy is uninformed. Bita has old ties to the Gracie family through Gracie Barra and from growing up in Teresopolis, Brazil. Any BJJ old timer can vouch for Bita (e.g., Ralph, Renzo, Rickson, Carlinhos, JJM, Drac, Robson M, etc).

I found this thread randomly and thought I would share some facts to clear up a lot of misinformation in this thread.

Tom Cicero trained under Ralph Gracie and Batata at least until purple belt in Mountain View. I'm not sure where he received his brown or black belts. He could've received his brown from Ralph, but I can't confirm since I left Ralph's by then. He was there the same time as many of the Ralph Gracie black belts teaching in San Jose today, including Dave Camarillo, Mike Prudencio (AKA, One World), Alex Kahnbabian (AKA).

He also trained under Adilson Bita Lima (soon 7th degree) and Marco Nascimento (5th degree) for a period of time (maybe a year?). Tom did not receive a black belt from either Bita or Marco and is not part of Pitbull BJJ.

Pitbull BJJ is legit. Bita has over 120 black belts (almost all in Teresopolis, Brazil), including many world champions.

Bita is the founder of Pitbull BJJ and Marco (Bita's first black belt) runs Pitbull BJJ in the US. Both are insanely legit. Anyone questioning Bita's or Pitbull's legitimacy is uninformed. Bita has old ties to the Gracie family through Gracie Barra and from growing up in Teresopolis, Brazil. Any BJJ old timer can vouch for Bita (e.g., Ralph, Renzo, Rickson, Carlinhos, JJM, Drac, Robson M, etc).

^^^and then double posted, 94 minutes apart...

Joao Cunha had a Pitbull BJJ school down here in SD for a long time. He's legit. It was a super tough school. It's gone now. Some crazy legal shit happened or something. But, isn't Dave Camarillo up there in San Jose, too. Always really liked his style.

If you are in San Jose you would be an absolute fool to not drop everything and take the Light Rail down to Santa Teresa and Bernal to train at AKA HQ …ASAP! That gym truly breeds champions.

The thing I miss most are the once-per-week "Marathon Rolls"… TEN five-minute rounds, 1 min break in between, 1 hour. You keep track of your subs, and how many times you got subbed. After class you do 10 pushups for every time you got subbed. (max 100) …then they go around the room and you get to GIVE OUT 10 push-ups for every sub. (You can get sweet revenge on that HW that ground your skull into powder lol)

This throws up some red flags, he probably earned his belt online from Rener and Rioron

Honestly, if a person is unable to go into detail about their belt lineage, or get offended by you asking, its usually because they have something to hide. Take a look at the yelp page you posted in the original question.. Some horror stories in some of the reviews.