Joining School/Conditioning

Hey guys, I could do with having some knowledge bombs dropped on me if you've got the time!
First off, my life story:
I'm a university student and the city I'm in has no good schools for jits, but back home I'm real close to Rick Young's school (he's a Mauricio Gomes black belt) so I'm looking to join there.
Now the conditioning part, basically I'm a skinny guy but I can see the beginnings of a belly coming on. I was thinking it would be a good idea to do jits while I was at home, which will be about 6 months of the year total, and then join a gym or start swimming while I'm at uni the other half.
Since I won't have the time or money to do both at once does anybody know what makes for good workouts while you're unable to train, I figured just swimming would be pretty good as it's a full-body thing but I wanted to hear your thoughts.

Random circuit training seemed to give me more cardio for rolling. More muscle stamina too if I performed the exercises in different ways.

When you say circuit training do you just mean going round various spots in a gym?
I've always found I have a really short attention span in a gym, I get distracted really easily and just kind of wander around, and never really commit too much. I suppose that's just something I need to work on myself.
It's one of the reasons I liked the workouts I used to do when I did Tae Kwon Do (way back when I was a kid, don't judge me!) because there was someone telling me what to do, I had no excuses

You should probably develop a more specific routine but yeah, I would just sprint on a treadmill until my heart rate was through the roof and the jump on a machine or just kick out reps for an exercise. I would do that till my muscle burned out and then get back on the treadmill. Rinse and repeat. My goal was just to decrease my muscle recovery time and increase my cardio.

Swimming is the way to go bro

www.dynamiteconditioning.tumblr.com

i post excersises and info on my site about training i put my clients through and all around fitness info. hopefully it can help also check out

www.monkeybargym.com

they post workouts there that i use myself sometimes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 4site

Swimming is the way to go bro

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See I really thought that would be the case, but every time I look, I always see a few guys who totally bash it saying that "it won't build strength or explosiveness" stuff like that, is that just total BS?
The way I see it, I'll probably be trying to fit these workouts into an hour between classes 5 days a week, so something like Mon, Tue, Thur = gym and then Wed, Fri = Swim. Or something along those lines

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dennis Martinez

www.dynamiteconditioning.tumblr.com

i post excersises and info on my site about training i put my clients through and all around fitness info. hopefully it can help also check out

www.monkeybargym.com

they post workouts there that i use myself sometimes

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I think I'd be more inclined to use your blog there, looks like some real good ones!
I'm generally a bit wary of websites that just look like they're trying to sell some new product, maybe I'm just being a dick though and need to have a proper look

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dennis Martinez

www.dynamiteconditioning.tumblr.com

i post excersises and info on my site about training i put my clients through and all around fitness info. hopefully it can help also check out

www.monkeybargym.com

they post workouts there that i use myself sometimes

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That is some good shit! Thanks for putting up the links!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Calum Whyte

See I really thought that would be the case, but every time I look, I always see a few guys who totally bash it saying that "it won't build strength or explosiveness" stuff like that, is that just total BS?
The way I see it, I'll probably be trying to fit these workouts into an hour between classes 5 days a week, so something like Mon, Tue, Thur = gym and then Wed, Fri = Swim. Or something along those lines

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Summary if you want to avoid wall of text:
Keep it simple until you learn etc.. at any stage walking around and jumping on random stuff will be a waste of time, and nutrition.(also imo if you don't have at least a minimal strength base then any amount of conditioning will barely benefit you)


Because it won't.. that's like saying running laps around a track will build large powerful legs. Swimming is great for conditioning though.. so keep at it. Also the reason you just go from one end of the gym to others etc.. is because you aren't exactly sure what you should be doing. So like others say.. find a routine.. a solid beginner strength routine imo.. as long as your consistent you'll make gains at this stage.

Also work your diet because that's the most important part. John berardi is who I recommend as far as info sense hes pretty much the master of nutrition(and anyone that's read things I say.. I don't actually follow what he says :P so don't judge him based on me)(he actually has a grapplers nutrition book as well but most of it is common sense imo)

As far as a routine.. "starting strength" is pretty much what anyone will say.. its tried and tested as a starting point.. dont overcomplicate things when you just start or you won't get anywhere.. just do something like that to burn through whatever beginner gains you have. Decide what weight you want to compete at and work to add/lose mass to get to that point then try and keep it in that area(you won't magically put on muscle so its easy to maintain weight)

Just for a fun read
This is an interesting training log
http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_onl...12734&pageNo=0
This is where it continues
http://www.5100block.com/Warrior-Athlete

Basically to give you an idea of how someone goes about mixing max effort lifts and conditioning together. Maybe more relatable..?!? I like browsing peoples training logs from time to time. I don't keep an online one sadly.. probably should so I'm held accountable.. mine is in a notebook.

Hi Calum, well I would suggest taking up the RKC system of Kettlebells. They are a fantastic tool for building fantastic overall strength and can provide great Cardio too. It's like a gym on a handle! Very convienient. They are also widely used by professional MMA fighters and can provide great strength without bulking up or losing flexibility. In fact they promote flexibility particularly of the hip flexors and shoulders. The idea behind their holistic whole body approach is that the body is a chain and of course a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.

There is a famous strength and conditioning coach called Steve Maxwell who is also a former BJJ Brown and Black belt senior Pan American and senior World champion. He is an expert on many old school training systems ( he believes them to be vastly superior to modern day Gym type stuff). He has stated in his opinion that doing the perfect Kettlebell swing alone is superior to 99% of the sophisticated strength and conditioning programs out there. Trust me when you do it with a proper weight Kettlebell it's strength and Cardio at the same time and it can be fucking brutal!! Swings are fantastic at building explosive strength as the power required is generated from the hips.

There are too many dumbed down useless Kettlebell schools out there like Mcdojos so if you were interested I would start with the book 'Enter the Kettlebell' by Pavel Tsatouline. He is considered to be the Guru of modern day Kettlebells.

Also diet is a very important consideration if you want to keep the fat off.

"He has stated in his opinion that doing the perfect Kettlebell swing alone is superior to 99% of the sophisticated strength and conditioning programs out there."

I disagree with this statement.. but I'm a nobody lol. Not trying to dog on kettlebells because they're great and versatile but I don't like the new fad of kettlebells.. I know they're old school but sometime in the past decade they came back like crazy.. they should just supplement your training.. I don't think you can solely use kettlebells and succeed strength/conditioning wise. But if that's all you have then you can make it a long way for sure. I think that's what makes them appealing for the most part.

"He is an expert on many old school training systems ( he believes them to be vastly superior to modern day Gym type stuff)"

I can agree with that.. some of the things my dad showed me from back in the Persian days etc... are pretty interesting and effective at least from what it seems :P. I can't use the things he has lol... not strong enough.. so its not from personal experience :P. Old school training is usually more fun as well.. if you're looking to be entertained. Another reason I think kettlebells are popular.. anyone can do it.. and for people that don't like to train its more entertaining.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pourya Samari

"He has stated in his opinion that doing the perfect Kettlebell swing alone is superior to 99% of the sophisticated strength and conditioning programs out there."

I disagree with this statement.. but I'm a nobody lol. Not trying to dog on kettlebells because they're great and versatile but I don't like the new fad of kettlebells.. I know they're old school but sometime in the past decade they came back like crazy.. they should just supplement your training.. I don't think you can solely use kettlebells and succeed strength/conditioning wise. But if that's all you have then you can make it a long way for sure. I think that's what makes them appealing for the most part.

"He is an expert on many old school training systems ( he believes them to be vastly superior to modern day Gym type stuff)"

I can agree with that.. some of the things my dad showed me from back in the Persian days etc... are pretty interesting and effective at least from what it seems :P. I can't use the things he has lol... not strong enough.. so its not from personal experience :P. Old school training is usually more fun as well.. if you're looking to be entertained. Another reason I think kettlebells are popular.. anyone can do it.. and for people that don't like to train its more entertaining.

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Hey Pourya nothing wrong with disagreeing! We are all entitled to our opinion! May I ask why you would disagree with that statement? Have you ever tried the Kettlebell swing with good sized weight eg 16 - 24Kg? Personally I do not have enough experience or knowledge about strength training programs and methods to have an opinion one way or another but personally I have found the swing has helped to make me stronger, faster and able to jump higher then I ever have before. Also Steve Maxwell has decades of experience of being a distinguised personal trainer as well as an ex BJJ world champ. Thats why I persoanlly hold him in high regard but it's easy to see why someone could disagree.

May I also ask why you do not like this fad of Kettlebells? I suppose we have to ask what is a fad? Well Kettlebells have been around in Russia since 1700 and were popularised in the last 10 years in the West by a guy called Pavel Tsatsouline.

You say you don't think you can use Kettlebells and succeed strength and conditioning wise. Well succeed for what? If you goal is to be a UFC fighter then you would need to add Barbell deadlifts and squats to attain the highest degree of overall strength. However a competitive grappler does not rely or need to have such an elite level of strength. You can do many things with a Kettlebell and can go up to very high weights and get a tremendous level of balanced overall strength and conditioning. The high rep Kettlebell snatch develops some really sick wrist strength which of course is important in BJJ.

Honestly they are a fantastic all round tool can really be described as a portible Gym on a handle. You just need to find a good reputable organisation to learn from otherwise you would be wasting your time with it doing ineffective work-outs.

Hey, if you like I can ask our PT and get him to put together some programs for you...you can check out his website at www.centurion training.com

Sorry www.centuriontrainingsystems.com

See, this is what I was getting at. If you over think this stuff you'll never go to the gym. You'll just sit around waiting for your kettle bells to arrive.

Go the gym tonight, just do anything and in the meantime figure out a more specific routine that fits your needs. I just do the ad hoc circuit training because it gives me an arbitrary sense of direction so I can get stuff done rather than waste my time thinking about which equipment to hit. But don't let your inefficiency in the gym deter you from working out, getting into the routine is the hardest part so get that out of the way first.

Another wall of text brought to you by Pourya...
summary: meh etc..
disclaimer: I somehow offend people from time to time when I talk about stuff like this.. so i'll add this too. I am not a professorial or certified in anything.. I just enjoy training/sports medicine/physical therapy.. so I get all beside myself talking about it.

This is a reply to james.. didn't want to quote.

I am not thoroughly experienced in kettlebells.. not wanting to sound like I am. I've done a little bit here and there with them but have opted for bb complexes and olympic lifts. But thats also because I have other goals outside of grappling especially with clean n jerk, and squat. I know how effective they are.. and simple because all you need is a few and you can do a ton of movements.

I say I don't like the fad because its like crossfit which drives me crazy as well.. people see something(claim it as theirs) then butcher the crap out of the movement and consider themselves elite etc.. you yourself said there is a bunch of kettlebell macdojos around.. thats all I was saying with that.. its just a pet peeve. I also know the history of kettlebells and who pavel tsatsouline is.. I've read a lot of his material.

I guess thats also me not really explaining myself well.. Kettlebells can build plenty of strength endurance explosiveness etc.. heaviest I've seen was a little over 120lbs(saw it sitting in the corner didn't even think about using it.. wouldn't be able to do anything but pick it up lol :P) And as I said you can do tons of movements.. and for bjj that isn't necessarily about maximal strength and where technique will generally trump all they're probably sufficient. This is what I guess I left out.. I conduct my strength/conditioning in the way a wrestler would.. or even other sports for that matter like football.. which may not be what some people want. But imo you have to train maximal strength.. and I enjoy training max strength tbh. A 50lb kettlebell won't make you strong enough to lift 400lbs etc.. So I think if you're actually going to a gym with equipment etc.. kettlebells should be supplemental to everything else.. everything building on each other. Also have you ever gassed.. you don't think hey that guy has way more endurance then me... you think holy shit that guy is 10 times stronger then me. Not always the case but a lot of the time its because they are a little bit(maybe a lot) stronger then you and they use less energy for the same thing... once you gas they feel like a brick wall.

I'm not sure if I explained myself well... I ended up rambling.. I have that habit. But i'm not trying to bash kettlebells... I'm just saying if you want to be at PEAK performance there is no way in hell ONLY using kettlebells will get you there. Thats why I quoted the 99% business.(looking back at this and seeing peak performance.. thats just about as stupid as saying you're building "functional strength" because it differs based on activity.. My view of what peak performance in grappling is different from your view of peak performance and I think thats where our differences are)

and to AJ camacho.. thats why I was saying starting strength.. for someone that never really has worked out seriously its the best starting point.. it appears hes a beginner and hasn't burned through his beginner gains.. so he just needs to do a couple compound movements each workout.. and he will most likely see gains for like 6 months or so before he has to "complicate" things. If you haven't figured it out after 6 months then I don't know lol..

ended up rambling again... humph..

Hi Pourya I suppose I should have explained myself more in my first comment. The original poster Calum said he was looking to do conditioning for 6 months of the year and BJJ the other 6 months but could not do both at the same time. So any conditioning he did for the 6 months at Uni he would not be able to maintain for the other 6 months. I suggested Kettlebells as it ticks the boxes for both strength and Cardio and it's something he can do at home or at Uni if he buys one for use. So he could do it all year round. Doing home workouts is a great timesaver ( 10 mins of Kettlebells swings is supposed to be more effective then 30mins of treadmill work according to one paper) but also cheaper. I just think it's overall much more convienient especially if he can only go to the Gym 6 months a year. Since he is a beginner the RKC system to me would be ideal as it starts off with just two moves. The Swing and the Turkish get-up and gradually moves up to more challenging movements.

Where we disagree is when you say you in your opinion you have to train maximal strength. I take the angle you should train for what you do. Why train like a professional athlete when what you do in life does not require it? To me having all that amazing strength and conditioning is waste of time unless it is fully utilised. I mean if he is just going to be rolling around doing BJJ does he really need to be doing Barbell deadlifts, Squats, Farmers walks, dumbell rows, advanced Plyometric routines, killer cardio etc? I mean to me all that effort and time is just not worth it unless your competing in a professional sport. You say a 50lb Kettlebell won't make you strong enough to lift 400lbs but will lifting 400lbs make you strong enough to do an L-sit on a set of Gymnastic rings or strong enough to smash a tower of bricks with a single strike? The point is your muscles do what you train them to do and for doing just BJJ I don't think you all the effort to attain Maximal strength is worth it. Also BJJ was made so you did not have to rely on brute strength but rather leverage and technique.

Just my opinion on the subject. I can see though why many would disagree with me.

Wow I really didn't expect to get so many responses! I kinda thought there would just be like, one guy who would post here and flame me for "being a noob" and say he was going to "teabag my mum....fag".
All this stuff seems really great, and I think i really do agree with AJ on this one, in that there's no use in me sitting around for weeks building up a great workout routine and that, in fact, doing anything is better than doing nothing like I'm doing just now (although it is exam time just now so I have reasons!).
As for the kettlebells. I've done a slight bit of reading since they were brought up, looked at some videos etc. and they look great....unfortunately I have a really small room here, I barely have enough room to lie down for a press-up so swinging a kettlebell's only going to put a hole in my wall or break my cupboard door.
And then there's the other part about me finding it really difficult to self-motivate, which is why I thought it would be best if I go to the gym in my breaks between classes. If there's other people there, I know I'll try harder, although ideally what I really need is someone shouting instructions at me and feeling a sense of shame if I don't do what they tell me to. I just think that if I go for the home workout the same thing will happen as before, I'll do 20 press-ups, 20 pull-ups, jerk off then watch videos on youtube

Hey Calum no worrys you do what you think is best for you. Everyone is different but if you feel you need someone to help you motivation wise then maybe starting a home work-out is not for you at this time. I used to be Gym freak for years going at least 3 -4 times a week but sometimes 5. I found doing a home workout with Kettlebells amoungst other modalities saves me alot of time and money for other things. However self-motivation has never been a problem for me so thats where we differ in that regard. I do think it's a bad idea to go to the Gym just 6 months a year then quit for the other 6 months. I would definetly find something you can do for conditioning when your home doing BJJ otherwise there will be a substantial drop in your conditioning levels and of course thats not a good thing.

Good luck with whatever routine you take up.

if you dont mind a very simple straight forward response, here it is. get a partner who is as dedicated or even more so than you... go to your local track, do some sprints to accelerate the heart rate... then follow it up with some navy seal style burpees... cardio and full body workout in one...maybe even incorporate some sprawls into the burpees... i do these with a buddy and we alternate/synchronize movement. ex: josue does one full burpee, as he finishes danny does one full burpee while josue rests, etc.... until we reach our goal of .... lets say 100 burpees. its only about a 3sec. rest inbetween burpees and no this is not our entire workout... but it would be a nice start for you.... add what you can or according to what your goals are search for things to add ....