How do i stop this from happening ! ?

Noob question , as i am a noob at this haha !


http://www.10thplanetjj.com/album.ph...tachmentid=815

Hopefully the image works.... dont think it will so if you could please look at picture attachment for a laugh lol ! or go to my page and album to see it :) thanks if anyone does it much appreciated :)

p.s. i was in lockdown , with one underhook , loosed my underhook when this happened lmao ! other hand was pushing elbow but wasnt helping much :)

any advice !

im a noob so no dickhead comments please lol !

cup the elbow and push it straight up above you.

hands on his ribcage and use your lockdown to whip him up an start playing whatever half guard game you like/have.
I'm sure you can find a video of the whip up somewhere.

Thanks il give that a go on thursday :) il try the whip up aswell never thought i would work though as my head is squashed to the side :) yeahi can whip up ive got eddies dvd and books :) i crush other noobs and mediocore guys the gym with it haha

Welcome to the family! Here's just my take:

For starters, be sure to strech your lockdown when you're in half guard. Extend your legs as far as you can. It looks from the picture like his hips are quite a bit higher than yours; with the lockdown extended his hips should be below your hips. That takes away most of his base; that and keeping him on defense by constantly whipping up will keep him off your face :). You still have your double-underhooks so you can whip up to your side. Gut it out through the pain of the elbow, put your hands on his ribs, extend your lockdown, and whip him up. :)

whip it... whip it good... whip it real good

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jamie.Gaffney

Noob question , as i am a noob at this haha !


http://www.10thplanetjj.com/album.ph...tachmentid=815

Hopefully the image works.... dont think it will so if you could please look at picture attachment for a laugh lol ! or go to my page and album to see it :) thanks if anyone does it much appreciated :)

p.s. i was in lockdown , with one underhook , loosed my underhook when this happened lmao ! other hand was pushing elbow but wasnt helping much :)

any advice !

im a noob so no dickhead comments please lol !

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...if you push his elbow OFF your face by hitting it behind his elbow, you can get an ARM TRIANGLE

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robert Sevigny

...if you push his elbow OFF your face by hitting it behind his elbow, you can get an ARM TRIANGLE

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can you explain that more, as in what part of my body would I ppush his elbow of my face with?
I feel as if his back muscles that push down on my face are going to be a lot stronger than my hand (triceps) attempting to move that off... especially if you are going against a larger oponent...
I'm also a noob and I had someone grab the back of my gi and apply the forearm on my throat.... he weighed so much i couldn't breathe, and this dude pulls it a lot. (i was mounted at the time though) thanks for the help.

Here's an attempt at a thorough breakdown on a real basic level. The fundamental problem is called a "cross-face", and pure wrestlers use it a ton. The idea is to 1) make life miserable, and 2) force you to "look away" so you can't turn into them. It is generally not the best thing to do on top against an experienced grappler, however; learn to handle it in various ways, and bate him into doing it.

Rather than just learn counters, you have to understand why, at the simplest level, this presents openings. From there, the options are endless. Problem #1: His arm is "open", as Brazilians like to say. In other words, elbow out, arm extended, and arm power is not connected to core strength. When your elbows are in tight, it's near impossible to just separate an elbow. But here, you can take his arm and manipulate or attack it.
Example of How to Take Advantage of Problem #1: Americana on the arm that is attacking your neck. Use to submit, sweep, or recover full guard.

Problem #2: His arm is crossing his body. If you have learned a basic arm-drag, you have seen how this presents an angle to attack the flank, and thus take the back. His arm is across AND extended, so passing it by your torso should be easy with the right attacks.
Example of How to Take Advantage of Problem #2: Right hand on wrist, left hand behind elbow (both on the problem arm) or left hand under-hooking. Arm-drag across your chest, reach around to grip far armpit, hip out, and take the back. Or any other version of a basic arm-drag.

Problem #3: With his leg locked in any half guard, that arm is a big part of the guy on top stopping a sweep right over that side (to clarify, the over the side of the trapped leg). He is taking away his ability to post, so sweeps in the direction will be available. At worst, he will have to remove the arm to base, which at least removes it from your throat.
Examples of How to Take Advantage of Problem #3: Any sweep in the near direction (such as the Plan B).

PS: Please let me know if this is interesting/helpful, or just a ton to read.

I'm kind of thinking with your left hand cup the elbow and put in on the right side of your neck, on the shoulder. Left hand hooks the left side of your opponent's head (pushing on his left ear, twisting his head) while your right arm hooks his left forearm (your right hand grabs your left ear...DEEP HOOK. Elbow to elbow). Push with your left hand and pull with your right, keeping the elbow in the crook of your neck. You may have a weird armbar or a sweep if you bridge over your right shoulder leaving your right leg hooked. If your flexible enough throw your left leg over his head and it's kind of like a fucked up carni that takes an armbar instead of a shoulder lock.

Wrap your head around that one! Does that sound stupid or could that work?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by karl a.k.

can you explain that more, as in what part of my body would I ppush his elbow of my face with?
I feel as if his back muscles that push down on my face are going to be a lot stronger than my hand (triceps) attempting to move that off... especially if you are going against a larger oponent...
I'm also a noob and I had someone grab the back of my gi and apply the forearm on my throat.... he weighed so much i couldn't breathe, and this dude pulls it a lot. (i was mounted at the time though) thanks for the help.

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In that picture I would use my left hand on their elbow to push their forearms across my body and to my right. When I say push, I really mean an open hand punch. I wouldn't be apologetic about it either, he's upped the game into goon territory, so it's time to escalate it. I would smack the shit out of that elbow while at the same time trying to turn my hips, head and upper body to the right. The combination of the hit, and turning my neck will usually cause his forearm to roll and slide past me. No it still won't feel good, but that's just how grappling works.

Once I clear the arm I usually let go of the lockdown, clinch with the over under and try to take the back. There is an arm triangle there but mine is shitty from that position. Most skilled guys won't grind the cross face for too long because it gives up the back. The underhook and whizzer are way better methods of controlling the bottom opponent, so the fact that your opponent does this is a good sign.

in my opinion, instead of pushing the elbow straight sideways, it seems to me that it is more effective to push it at an upwards angle. the shoulder seems to be weaker moving vertically from what i've experienced.. well at least when people are pushing their forearm into your neck it is

You dont need to stop that from happening. He is compromising his base when he does that...just suck up the pressure and continue on with the series...dont let is distract you from your flow. That all it is...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robert Sevigny

...if you push his elbow OFF your face by hitting it behind his elbow, you can get an ARM TRIANGLE

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Not without giving up the right underhook, which you need to keep in order to move forward with the double underhook series (ie. the whip up, old school, electric chair, dogfight, etc.).

Jason and Kevin correctly pointed out what you should be doing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Harry Evans

Here's an attempt at a thorough breakdown on a real basic level. The fundamental problem is called a "cross-face", and pure wrestlers use it a ton. The idea is to 1) make life miserable, and 2) force you to "look away" so you can't turn into them. It is generally not the best thing to do on top against an experienced grappler, however; learn to handle it in various ways, and bate him into doing it.

Rather than just learn counters, you have to understand why, at the simplest level, this presents openings. From there, the options are endless. Problem #1: His arm is "open", as Brazilians like to say. In other words, elbow out, arm extended, and arm power is not connected to core strength. When your elbows are in tight, it's near impossible to just separate an elbow. But here, you can take his arm and manipulate or attack it.
Example of How to Take Advantage of Problem #1: Americana on the arm that is attacking your neck. Use to submit, sweep, or recover full guard.

Problem #2: His arm is crossing his body. If you have learned a basic arm-drag, you have seen how this presents an angle to attack the flank, and thus take the back. His arm is across AND extended, so passing it by your torso should be easy with the right attacks.
Example of How to Take Advantage of Problem #2: Right hand on wrist, left hand behind elbow (both on the problem arm) or left hand under-hooking. Arm-drag across your chest, reach around to grip far armpit, hip out, and take the back. Or any other version of a basic arm-drag.

Problem #3: With his leg locked in any half guard, that arm is a big part of the guy on top stopping a sweep right over that side (to clarify, the over the side of the trapped leg). He is taking away his ability to post, so sweeps in the direction will be available. At worst, he will have to remove the arm to base, which at least removes it from your throat.
Examples of How to Take Advantage of Problem #3: Any sweep in the near direction (such as the Plan B).

PS: Please let me know if this is interesting/helpful, or just a ton to read.

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Thanks a lot, mentioning of the arm drag and the fact that one opens themselves up is somthing i missed. The brown belts love to use this against me, ill definatley get some sweeps from this

Thanks alot for all the help team ! the same guy also does this in side control but thats a different story lol I let you guys know how i get on tonight ! might just pull half guard wait for thi to happen and whip up lol