the omoplata escape I've never really seen addressed

[Bryan Gore]

It's been a few years since anyone tried to omoplata me but since I got the Advanced Rubber Guard book I've been thinking about the move a lot. Back when I was rolling with a few guys who played the rubber guard a lot, whenever they moved their arm so that it was grabbing their leg on the same side of my head as that leg, I would just spin around and end up past their guard in side control.

For example, if he has my right arm to the mat and he is holding his left leg with his right hand to the right of my head, I would always react by stepping forward with my right leg and spinning around. Most of the time he wouldn't be able to keep my arm between his legs and I would slip out. Maybe 2-3 times my right arm stayed stuck, but I would fight and get my left arm across his body so I had leverage to pull my right arm out. I think after I did that once or twice he learned to fight me on getting my left hand over his body so we just stayed stalemated in that position.

I saw one other person do this a long time ago in the IFL. I don't remember who so I haven't had any luck finding it on youtube. In that fight it ended up stalemated the same way I described before.

I also saw it on MTS, but unfortunately I can't remember which episode. I'll keep trying to find it again though. Eddie was rolling with someone and they did this. That guy put his non-locked arm over Eddie's body to get leverage to pull his locked arm out and Eddie grabbed that guy's head and neck cranked him somehow. He called it some kind of twister variation. So I guess that is the solution? Is that neck crank the reason why you never see people using that method to escape the omoplata? The omoplata seems so risky to me because of the chance that they'll pass your guard with it like that. Do most people just have such good leg squeeze that they're confident the guy won't be able to slip out if he turns that way?

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I'm sorry if this seems like a stupid question. Right now I'm rolling at a gym where nobody really speaks English. So can't ask questions or ask training partners to go to certain positions so I can test things. I'd really like to get to that position where Eddie neck cranked the guy and see how that neck crank feels for myself. And nobody really goes for omoplatas against me so I can't keep doing what I used to do until someone shows me by example how to shut what I'm doing down.

[NikNikAndCauliflower]

I'm not 100% getting it - do you mean spinning around to the other side or something else?

[Bryan Gore]

In episode 43 of Mastering the System at around 49:45 there's an example of it in the youtube version.

[scottross]

The reason why you shouldn't normally be able to step over an oma plata the way you are discussing is that there should always be an arm around the waist, that prevents both the forward roll and the step over. However, if your opponent is slow about grabbing your waist, it's a legit way to escape.

The reason Eddie was able to transition to the Twister Plata in the video you have posted is that the person in the video turned his back too much - he should have kept his chest towards the ground. It's not the typical response, the guy just gave it to Eddie.

[Bryan Gore]

I see how the arm around the waist stops a roll, but I don't think it can stop them from turning the way he did.

Turning and not keeping your chest to the ground is what I'm somewhat advocating, or at least worried about the opponent doing. I feel like it's going to be very difficult at that point to keep their arm trapped. If they put their non-trapped arm over your body they can use that for leverage to pull their trapped arm out. And the neck crank seems risky because it's adding force to their attempt to pull their arm out. I don't know; nobody ever tried to neck crank me there. Everytime I did it I was able to pull my arm out as soon as I could get my non-trapped arm across their body. The only time I didn't pull my arm out and get side control was when the guy blocked me from getting my arm across. That was what happened in the IFL fight too. They just stalemated there until the end of the round. Which is better than getting omoplata'd. With no time limit I think eventually their legs would get tired of squeezing to keep you there.

[gene k]

So basically you're limp arming out? Sounds like a valid escape but you could end up in the twistoplata/crucifix type position. Also I have to ask you the level of your competition, no offense, but is it possible that the training partners you have done this to don't have the best Jiu-claw/omoplata game? Again no offense just a thought..

Here is the Twist-o-plata by Alder :

[Bryan Gore]

Well, I think the fact that I was able to do it consistently but it's not something people commonly do means that they must have been doing something wrong. I'm just trying to figure out what they weren't doing that they should have been doing. But maybe most people have a good enough squeeze with their legs that they aren't worried about you being able to pull your arm out even if you can get your arm across their body and use it to pull.

After watching the twist-o-plata video, I'm thinking it's just a matter of developing the grip between the legs to keep them from pulling their arm out. He seems pretty confident about being able to hold it in there. The idea of one trapped arm being all that's keeping my opponent from being in side control makes me nervous, but I guess I just need to get over that.

Edit: Just wanted to say "thanks" to those who tried to figure out what the heck I was talking about and helped me work this out in my head.

[scottross]

Alder notes that it is important to grab the wrist, squeeze knees tight, and trap the free arm with your arms to avoid your opponent from limp arming out around 1:50. In other words, it's not just the legs - it's important to trap the arm that you use to leverage yourself out. Also, pants or leggings help.

[Bryan Gore]

Well at some point you have to let go of his wrist to do the neck crank, kimura, or armbar. So you have to be able to hold him in there with just your legs. I think the kimura would be the best option since it's the one where you don't have to allow him to get his arm across your body to where he can use it to pull his body around to pull his trapped arm out. With the neck crank you're actually pulling him in the same direction he's trying to pull himself to get his arm out so I think I would test both the others before going to that one.

[NikNikAndCauliflower]

I get what you mean now. I don't have anything technical to add, just that I'd advise trying to work with tried and true methods for the most part - rather than seeing what you can "get away with"