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  1. #1

    Best explanation I've seen for why Metamoris poaching EBI talent is bad for the sport

    This is from Reddit user @renstheripper. Thread is at http://www.reddit.com/r/bjj/comments...g_fighters_on/

    "It is a terrible business decision. Cannibalizing a young and growing market.

    Put it this way. Person A sells fruit salad on a Monday and Person B sells fruit salad on a Thursday. The consumers want fruit salad so they buy it on a Monday and a Thursday. Person A signs exclusive use of apples. Person B now has no apple in their fruit salad. Person A spruiks their apple content. Consumers now may not buy the apple-less fruit salad because they like apples and they are now cornered into buying fruit salad once a week when they liked having it twice. They now are driven to find an alternative on a Thursday and they find something they like. Sometimes they even have the alternative on a Monday which means less for Person A too.

    Cut to the apple farmer, he is getting more per apple but selling less apples. His demand has stagnated and now his only ability to garner income is linked to one source. Other fruit producers are selling their produce to pie makers and juicers. They are more prominent in the market, their products are growing and becoming better. The apple farmer spends his income on a G in a Gi CD single and feels better.

    What has happened to the entire market? Whilst once there may have been a market of 100 purchasers a week, it is down to 80. Each seller used to have 50 customers each. Now Person A has retained 45 as some have moved onto another product altogether and Person B is down to 35 customers because some motherfuckers like apples. Without a solid competitor, Person A's fruit salad has no peer to help drive innovation. Their fruit salad has not improved. The market has shrunk and they have capped growth. Before the entire market was able to grow to a more sustainable level they capped the growth potential of the entire market. Is 50% or 100% better? 50% of a 200 consumer market is better than 100% of an 80 consumer market.

    TL;DR - Limiting a total market in a growth industry is done at the peril of all stakeholders. It is a level of dumb that is immeasurable. Never did the purchase of a competing event's PPV affect Metamoris. To then affect their quality is to limit the entire $ value of the market which means less investors, promoters, competitors and consumers."

  2. #2
    Joey Wren's Avatar
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    I'll drink to that.

  3. #3
    Brian Tupper's Avatar
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    Damn....that pretty much sums it up.

  4. #4
    Tori Applegate's Avatar
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    Yea, he's right. I feel like by Metamoris trying to tie these players down they are not in any way contributing to the growth of jiu jitsu, but instead, stunting it. I believe the most the would be able to compete is once a month. And Metamoris only puts on a card like every four month, Ibjjf has lame rules, and then that leaves ADCC. That doesn't sound exciting for the Garry Tonnons, Eddie Cummings, Nathan Orchards, Geo, and Boogies of the world.

    It's not one hundred percent about the money with these guys, it's about the fight and working towards being the best. I wouldn't want to be limited to 3 tournaments..I feel like it somewhat kills the excitement. These guys FIGHT. Like a super fight this weekend then EBI next and to weeks from now go to some ADCC trials..then who knows from there. Then they do seminars in between and stuff. That's the friggin life. You cannot put a limit on these guys lifestyle like that. And honestly, limiting their freedom like that also limits their growth. Metamoris is close-minded and just isn't about how these competitors do what they do.
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  5. #5

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    After listening to EBR #85.... seems this issue might be completely personal on Ralek's part, not business at all.

    One thing seems clear though, this feud between a certain portion of the Gracie family and Eddie isn't going away.
    Last edited by Craig Murray; 04-14-2015 at 08:53 AM.

  6. #6

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    Poaching is not allowing the sport to grow at all, and that's why there are many different MMA organizations and not just one. Jiu Jitsu is a living and breathing martial art that needs space to grow in all areas, not to be restricted from everyone. A contract is cool to a certain extent, but not the way Ralek is going about it. I kind of understand why Dillon Danis signed because that type of offer for a 21 year old sounds good (I would have made the same choice at that age). Will he learn from it, heck yeah, but who are we to blame him though.

    Tori sums it up real well though that being tied down to only approximately three tournaments a year is like drowning someone or taking candy from a child. It's something we all love and enjoy why would you want to limit anyone's potential? Another factor to contribute into all of this is what if they get hurt? Then this keeps them from competing and who knows how long they have till their next tournament. Hell don't forget about us the fans who love to watch these top level guys compete, and only being able to watch them a couple times a year is just crappy. This is sad to see people have to limit jiu jitsu because of a feud or difference in beliefs, but as for me I am a bigger fan of EBI not to say I wont watch this sport wherever its representing.

  7. #7
    Unfortunately I feel like Metamoris is trying to become like the UFC in a sense. Where they want to be the biggest promotion out there. I mean Exclusive contracts to compete in a grappling event. That makes no sense, especially because Metamoris only puts out 2 (or so) events a year. They lost an amazing competitor in Garry Tonnon, he has the most submission wins in Metamoris, and greed has pushed him away. SHame....

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith D View Post
    Unfortunately I feel like Metamoris is trying to become like the UFC in a sense. Where they want to be the biggest promotion out there. I mean Exclusive contracts to compete in a grappling event. That makes no sense, especially because Metamoris only puts out 2 (or so) events a year. They lost an amazing competitor in Garry Tonnon, he has the most submission wins in Metamoris, and greed has pushed him away. SHame....
    From what Eddie was saying in EBR#85, it kinda sounds like these deals were not exclusive. It sounded more like it was a contract, and it was being offered under the condition that the athlete not compete in EBI3. It was a deliberate and directed attack on EBI, and had nothing to do with exclusivity at all.

    It kinda sounded like Eddie wasn't totally sure, and it sounded like so far no one has shown him one of these "exclusive contracts"... but it was sure sounding fishy...

    And remember as far as we know, only EBI competitors were even approached about deals.... are all the other metamoris participants under contract now too? It sure doesn't sound like it.
    Last edited by Craig Murray; 04-14-2015 at 11:01 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Craig Murray View Post
    After listening to EBR #85.... seems this issue might be completely personal on Ralek's part, not business at all.

    One thing seems clear though, this feud between a certain portion of the Gracie family and Eddie isn't going away.
    I think business it's a mix of personal and business, but it's a bad business decision. I do think Ralek wants to corner the market on these sub only PPV type of events, and he's looking to almost do a Netflix type of service. He's going about it the wrong way. His exclusive contract would allow Garry Tonon to compete in IBJJF or ADCC events, but just not other big PPV style events like EBI, Polaris, etc. It's a bad idea. Grappling isn't to the point yet where Metamoris is competing over the same dollar as EBI. They're trying to get the same consumer base, and eliminating guys like Tonon or Danis from the market is beyond retarded.

    I don't care what anyone says. It's almost impossible to find grapplers that can virtually guarantee exciting matches. Even really exciting grapplers can have awful matches. Tonon and Danis are a few of the young guns that can do that. Marcelo Garcia is more or less retired. Bill Cooper isn't competing much and is basically gone. Jeff Glover has started developing a style that is still sub oriented but more defensive/counter style and less over the top offense. Palhares can't be counted on to show up or be found. I can think of others but you get the point.

    It's tough to find up and comers that fit the bill. A sport about control is always going to be a hard sell. Tonon was a big one that could help, and Metamoris definitely fucked up by losing the only guy to get a sub on their last card.

  10. #10
    Tom Carbone's Avatar
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    At this point, it's up to the competitors to due what's best for the sport. Hopefully they will do the right thing. I have more faith in them than athletes from other sports. Garry is a good example of that

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