Spinal Fusions and Jiu Jitsu

[Dave Brown]

Jon you could just let him roll with me we could start our on bad back division of 10th planet but in all seriousness I think herzog was on point.

[Chris Herzog]

Coach, you know a doctor is gonna tell him no. Could you get a doctor to clear you? jussayin

Its about liability. Being the Head Coach its my job to protect everyone; the potential student, the academy, the owner of the academy and the rest of the students at the academy. If a doctor won't clear him, he can't train at our place. I'm not going to risk the owner loosing his gym because of it. We owe it to the rest out our students to make sure they aren't at risk either whether its a potential lawsuit or them loosing the place they train and invested time and money in. We've had to turn down people in the past because our insurance provider said they wouldn't cover a student. When it your lively hood your perspective changes. And whether a doctor would clear me or not is irrelevant, I'm in charge

[Jon Helton]

Thanks for the feedback guys. Insurance provider didn't have a problem with it as long as my waiver was signed. I'm still gonna get the doctors permission and just just take it easy with him. Very easy.

[Chris Herzog]

Jon just so you understand waiver are NOT full proof. They are just a consideration in legal matters.


...and just so I'm not misunderstood, if the doctor came back and said "no", I'd feel for the guy. However those of us that have been in the game a long time understand what could happen and we know more than the doctors when it comes to what the student will be subject too, they are just going off a bare boned basic understanding of what we do, leaving the instructor with full cupability. That is not something I'm willing to shoulder. I live with (as does my wife and some extent my students)the damage I've done to myself over the years, I'm not going to be responsible for allowing it to happen to someone else.

[Jon Helton]

Thanks for the input Coach. That's why I posted it up. Some of you guys have a lot more experience with this sort of thing than me.
It is probably just better to turn him down and avoid everything. I would hate to cause more damage to him and/or possibly lose my business because of it.

[stlnl]

Jon just so you understand waiver are NOT full proof. They are just a consideration in legal matters.


...and just so I'm not misunderstood, if the doctor came back and said "no", I'd feel for the guy. However those of us that have been in the game a long time understand what could happen and we know more than the doctors when it comes to what the student will be subject too, they are just going off a bare boned basic understanding of what we do, leaving the instructor with full cupability. That is not something I'm willing to shoulder. I live with (as does my wife and some extent my students)the damage I've done to myself over the years, I'm not going to be responsible for allowing it to happen to someone else.

A waiver isnt of course fool proof, but it is pretty darned solid against litigation regarding things that are likely to happen in a grappling class. The grey area of a waiver is usually regarding neglect or reckless behavior with regard to an instructor. A guy who goes into a grappling class, with rods in his back, reads and signs a waiver knowing its physical if pretty much legless legally.

My point, and I should think everyone's is to get the guy's doctor to clear him for his own health and well being. But I would agree in the litigious climate of today's USA, it doesnt hurt to be careful.

[bobby rivers]

And whether a doctor would clear me or not is irrelevant, I'm in charge

Lol. Word!

[bobby rivers]

I'm not going to be responsible for allowing it to happen to someone else.

Do you think you could have gotten where you are without the injuries? Cause I want your life. Awkward?

But, i do realize that this is a much more sensitive case than most and should be treated with great caution. He's seriously compromised. My case is what you alluded to earlier Chris. Doctors often see great risk in what we know as a controlled training environment. They often say things like 'no contact sports' when they have never played a sport. Is there a super waiver? No doctor could ever tell me not to train. But I dont have rods in my back..

[Chris Herzog]

Do you think you could have gotten where you are without the injuries? Cause I want your life. Awkward?

Like an grizzled old lion, its just made me a bit meaner

[Chris Herzog]

A waiver isnt of course fool proof, but it is pretty darned solid against litigation regarding things that are likely to happen in a grappling class. The grey area of a waiver is usually regarding neglect or reckless behavior with regard to an instructor. A guy who goes into a grappling class, with rods in his back, reads and signs a waiver knowing its physical if pretty much legless legally.

My point, and I should think everyone's is to get the guy's doctor to clear him for his own health and well being. But I would agree in the litigious climate of today's USA, it doesnt hurt to be careful.

It sure as shit wont stop them from trying. Win or Loose a small business can loose its ass forking over between 5-10K for defense and legal fees.