Atheist 1 - Christian guy 0

[Pete Daly]

I'm saying what's the difference if you claim god doen't exist. That claim being: god does not exists. Make the claim, back it with evidence. That is how something is determined whether or not to be true. In this case, there is no evidence to back the claim, therefor it is logical that we determine the claim untrue.

That's the thing, i'm not making a claim. Atheism is the logical default, theism is the claim.

[Pete Daly]

I'm saying what's the difference if you claim god doen't exist. That claim being: god does not exists. Make the claim, back it with evidence. That is how something is determined whether or not to be true. In this case, there is no evidence to back the claim, therefor it is logical that we determine the claim untrue.

Put it this way, pretend i'm a child, 4 years old. I have never heard of theism, atheism, agnosticism, nothing.

Now make a claim about god.

You could say that there is no god.
I would respond by asking, "what is god?"
Then you would need to explain a theistic position on god, because there is no atheistic belief in god. Theism is the claim, not atheism.

[Andrew Maxwell]

That's the thing, i'm not making a claim. Atheism is the logical default, theism is the claim.

Atheism isn't the default. Not beliving anything at all is the default. A child is born with no concept of god what so ever and an Athiest denies gods existance and has a concept of god in mind to deny. Default is not even realizing there is a debate to be had.

[Pete Daly]

Atheism isn't the default. Not beliving anything at all is the default. A child is born with no concept of god what so ever and an Athiest denies gods existance and has a concept of god in mind to deny. Default is not even realizing there is a debate to be had.

correct

[Andrew Maxwell]

Put it this way, pretend i'm a child, 4 years old. I have never heard of theism, atheism, agnosticism, nothing.

Now make a claim about god.

You could say that there is no god.
I would respond by asking, "what is god?"
Then you would need to explain a theistic position on god, because there is no atheistic belief in god. Theism is the claim, not atheism.

I get what you are saying now, but i still don't see Atheism as a default. The default would be like Nihilism or some thing like that. Where one has no opinion or believes nothing at all

[chronic_jiujitsu]

Put it this way, pretend i'm a child, 4 years old. I have never heard of theism, atheism, agnosticism, nothing.

Now make a claim about god.

You could say that there is no god.
I would respond by asking, "what is god?"
Then you would need to explain a theistic position on god, because there is no atheistic belief in god. Theism is the claim, not atheism.

so what DO you believe? like do you have any opinion at all on how things were started? and what was the reason you chose to do this with just religion? why not with any other thing in the world? like gravity, or the water cycle? what allowed you to hear the theory of these things and then decide to say "sounds interesting, i want to know more" until you were taught about them and chose that those were things you wanted to believe in. was it just because you never saw any logical explanation when it came to religion? or it just never interested you?

[Pete Daly]

I get what you are saying now, but i still don't see Atheism as a default. The default would be like Nihilism or some thing like that. Where one has no opinion or believes nothing at all

Hmm, I think you might be misunderstanding the meaning behind atheism. It's basically saying, "I don't know, and neither does anyone else."

[Andrew Maxwell]

Hmm, I think you might be misunderstanding the meaning behind atheism. It's basically saying, "I don't know, and neither does anyone else."

Thats called Agnostic when you say "I don't know". Athiesm is saying "I know there is no god".

[Andrew Maxwell]

Hmm, I think you might be misunderstanding the meaning behind atheism. It's basically saying, "I don't know, and neither does anyone else."

Like I said earlier, Its hard to debate when you don't have your premises defined. Semantics and the way people define things is almost always an issue

[Pete Daly]

so what DO you believe? like do you have any opinion at all on how things were started? and what was the reason you chose to do this with just religion? why not with any other thing in the world? like gravity, or the water cycle? what allowed you to hear the theory of these things and then decide to say "sounds interesting, i want to know more" until you were taught about them and chose that those were things you wanted to believe in. was it just because you never saw any logical explanation when it came to religion? or it just never interested you?

I don't believe in anything, from a religious stand point. I have no idea what happens when you die etc.

I don't really have an opinion on how things started, but the big bang is the most plausible answer. Gravity and the water cycle definitely have explanations, but that's a totally different subject (science). Gravity is under attack atm, but I think it will be proven once again.

I'm not sure why i'm interested in these things, but I definitely am. Just the way I was built I suppose. I'm constantly questioning my beliefs. It's like jiu jitsu; something has worked for me in the past, but that doesn't mean it's the best way (see London).

As it happens, I was confirmed Lutheran, but I thought my way out of the belief. I got myself an education, attended logic classes, science classes, etc. and applied them to the things I knew before. The new information was not congruent with my former beliefs, so I dropped said beliefs.