Is Judo obsolete in bjj?

[michael h]

IJF pissed all over Judo as a sport. They are trying to take out grabbing the legs now. Da fuck?! Kata Guruma is gone. They are eliminating throws because they are worried about wrestlers crossing over and tainting the "purity" of the sport. It's crap.

There is a new tactic in international judo in which you cause your opponent to draw a shido by offering up the leg with a harai goshi and tempting him to touch your leg and get penalized. IJF should be SOB. They want judoka to win judo tourneys not wrestlers or bjj players..

[Kyle Spalla]

There is a new tactic in international judo in which you cause your opponent to draw a shido by offering up the leg with a harai goshi and tempting him to touch your leg and get penalized. IJF should be SOB. They want judoka to win judo tourneys not wrestlers or bjj players..

I see this tactic just as shady as forcing the leg over to get the DQ for knee reaping, also bullshit. I understand them wanting to promote Judoka winning tournaments, but not at the cost of deluding the entire art form.

[Kurzy]

Back to the root of this thread, does no one else think this is sandbagging?

Fighting as a whitebelt or bluebelt in a JJ Tourney but also being a blackbelt in Judo?

What is the difference between that and a Black Belt in TaeKwon Do entering as a white or blue belt in a Karate Tourney? I would love to hear some opinions on this, because my gut instinct is to call "Sandbagger". No offence intended Michael H, for real.

[bobby rivers]

Not.

[Kurzy]

Really?

[michael h]

Having rolled with lots of different ranks I can say that I might be able to run through anyone standing once we hit the ground it's a whole different story. Due to the sport of judo most judoka don't have much when it comes to newaza. They would rather focus their entire time on throwing techniques and a little bit on turtling or on getting to a lockdown situation which they only have to be in for a few seconds. The only judo black belts whom you see competing at the higher levels of grappling already compete at the highest levels of judo and typically their instructor doesn't teach just straight judo (ex. Ronda rousey, jimmy pedro, gokor chivichyan, gene lebell, manny gamburian, Karo parisyan etc...). Most of these individuals run in the same circle of judo, sambo, and bjj in their training.

This fact is especially driven home by the fact that in a bjj tournament if you don't want to get thrown by a judo black belt in competition then all you gotta do is sit. Then it comes down to who has a better guard or guard passing. Typically judoka don't train a lot of guard passing since judo does not usually use the guard (beside butterfly). Even if the judoka passes, the typical judo black belt is looking to settle into a holding technique rather than any submission, many judoka might not even have any excellent subs since they can win judo tournaments with holding techs.

Now if you think of the time in for a judo black belt it could be earned in 2-4 years of 80-90% standing techniques and 10-20% ground techniques which means a judo black belt may typically only spend 8-10 months worth of training on the ground in a typical overly sporting club (does not hold true for coach herzog/ under mark Tripp, or anyone under gokor chivichyan or gene lebell, and jimmy pedro).

This is just an over simplification of an issue that must be taken on a case by case basis but this is reflective of the main body of judo clubs.

[Mike Nall]

[Mike Nall]

There's still great Judo at all levels in BJJ, it's just less common at lightweight and below. Not obsolete at all. As long as BJJ keeps a very nonrestrictive ruleset Judo will have its place.

[Aaron Gustaveson]

Back to the root of this thread, does no one else think this is sandbagging?

Fighting as a whitebelt or bluebelt in a JJ Tourney but also being a blackbelt in Judo?

What is the difference between that and a Black Belt in TaeKwon Do entering as a white or blue belt in a Karate Tourney? I would love to hear some opinions on this, because my gut instinct is to call "Sandbagger". No offence intended Michael H, for real.

It matters on the rules the tournament sets out for determining your level. Years of grappling experience make a lot more sense to me than belts. If you follow the rules then its not sandbagging.

Competition makes sense to me, not belts. Unless you have to earn the belt by beating people who already have that belt. I feel if you've never competed then you're a white belt until you do. What about submission wrestlers that dont use belts at all? The tourny better address that or how can you call them a sandbagger?
There was a thread the other day where a guy said he got his blue by tapping a blackbelt. If that happens then what do these belts really mean? You dont know until you grapple with the person. Besides belts normally represent a level of technical knowledge not necessarily physical ability, ie tiny women and old men blackbelts.

I could be way wrong on this?

[Aaron Gustaveson]

Blackbelt in judo take 2-4 years? my dad did it for 3-4 years and he was brown, maybe cause you have to be over a certain age to get the black. Seems like some other more traditional japanese arts. You get to black faster because there are only 4-6 belts but then you get dan rankings after that.

In about 3 days Im going to start training with a guy who is ranked in judo by a judoka that spain used to send to the olympics. Getting ready for naga portland. This guy http://www.10thplanetjj.com/members/...zack_pomerleau