Olympic TKD

[Tim Elliott]

But the whole foot movement thing, is where you did say I said something not true (with me saying that plant foot moves, pretty much any round kick that has bad intentions on it) when, from my experience, watching hundreds of Kickboxing (K1) and thai boxing matches that plant foot is going to move, even if its only a rotation.

I think you are confusing the spinning in a circle, as something I was endorsing. I have only ever seen it endorsed for beginners/shadow boxing tool. I was asking Frank as to the "switch" step he was talking about from a rear round kick. I could only guess he was talking about the movement of the plant foot in the direction of the kick to open the hips, and since I see almost every top level pro, doing just that ( a tiny step when kicking) when they mean to do damage.......well it seems that is the way its done.

So we are on the same page I think. Sorry.

[stlnl]

No problem since what you were describing sounded like what I meant, I was thinking we were having a communication break down (talking about the same thing, but without pictures - hard to follow) and the word Rotation got taken for something its not, but I should have said pivot I guess, for better clarity.

[frank-theman-james]

Could you describe the Switch step they use with a rear leg round kick? I have been around a bunch of guys who have trained both more dutch style kickboxing and traditional Thai trained and I have never seen this.

sorry it took so long to get back to you. a switch step occurs when a guy with basic knowledge of round kicks sets up by starting with a stepping motion and turning the front foot open as to open his hips for power, instead of pivoting on the ball of his foot as he should which doesnt telegraph and increases power. that switch step will signal his intentions everytime

[frank-theman-james]

Im guessing Frank means the step in on the rear kick, rather than a switch, otherwise it doesnt make any sense.

yea, thats what most people refer to it as, I said switch step in reference to him turning his foot out switching its position. most guys call switch kicking a transition in stance to set up a kick from the off sided leg which is pretty much the same thing, a telegraphing of kicks.

[frank-theman-james]

It will still be less powerful than rotating the foot, unless you are going to show me something really, really revolutionary I have somehow managed to miss the past 13 years.

actually, spinning on the ball is more powerful and faster. ask any tkd guy to do a back leg round kick and see the power generated when done correctly. power is generated from your hips and proper technique. you have to remember that muay thai was created after the japanese invasion through indochina, where they captured their enemies and made them train and fight for them on their march to china

[frank-theman-james]

Is this the step in your talking about?

yes and its a telegraph for someone who understands range and distances. the power generated here is what we call in kenpo, back up mass, where his forward momentum is helping to generate power. his hips open in the beginning and close on the end of his kick. he doesnt pivot on the front ball opening his hips through the kick, thus actually losing power by not utilizing his full range of motion. and yes this is very popular with dutch style fighters who got their roots front french savat fighters. real muay thai fighters dont step this way before throwing their back leg round kicks, choosing speed momentum as their power.

[Tim Elliott]

I hear people say maximum power generation a lot. Maximum power generation probably involves getting a run up. Doesnt make it practical in a fight. There isnt a lot of similarity between a Muay Thai kick and a Karate kick. The power comes from different places.

[stlnl]

actually, spinning on the ball is more powerful and faster. ask any tkd guy to do a back leg round kick and see the power generated when done correctly. power is generated from your hips and proper technique. you have to remember that muay thai was created after the japanese invasion through indochina, where they captured their enemies and made them train and fight for them on their march to china

There is more power in the Thai kick, period. Trained both. Alot. I agree a run up isnt smart till the opponent is doing the chicken dance, or otherwise off balance or hurt, but a TKD round kick isnt in the same league, esp with regard to penetrating power (ie the reason for the way Thais kick has alot to do with damaging the legs).

But you can still land a kick with that step Ubereem is using, but you have to lead with punches (and the dutch preach this) and then lower the boom down low. Personally, I think leading with any kick isnt too smart (past a fast teep or the like).

[Tim Elliott]

I wish I had better internet. I would post Yodsankalai videos. In my humble opionion, he has the most devastating kick in fighting. He turns the foot slightly, but he doesnt turn the heel towards the target or roll his hip over. He just throws it. Brutally, and he doesnt give a shit what he hits with it. No matter where it lands, its a potential fight finisher. If someone had a kick like that in MMA it would be very interesting. You dont see people use an arm kick very often, but the arm is a great target. Hes my favourite fighter by miles.

A persons kick is specific to them to some degree. All techniques have a lot of play in them to allow for different physical attributes.

One thing with the Thai kick is that you can walk and kick.

[Tim Elliott]

It does amuse me that everyone is talking about that video like it is a textbook demonstration. Not a huge man kicking a tiny girl half way across the room