"gimmick Moves"

[Jeremy Gates]

There's only one thing I can think of that I really dislike and I think of as cheap. In mount or even half guard ( when I have double unders ) and top guy puts on arm under your head and the other arm across you're throat. Isn't that a no gi version of the ezikeal choke ? No sure but certain people I rolled with and used it and it's like oh ok well I'll tap to it but u won't catch me again with it kinda thing.

[Matt Young]

There's only one thing I can think of that I really dislike and I think of as cheap. In mount or even half guard ( when I have double unders ) and top guy puts on arm under your head and the other arm across you're throat. Isn't that a no gi version of the ezikeal choke ? No sure but certain people I rolled with and used it and it's like oh ok well I'll tap to it but u won't catch me again with it kinda thing.

That is one of the things I have done, but it is not really to get them to tap as much as it is to get them to open up to another attack.

[sean applegate]

a tap is a tap....thats just ego talking

[Cora Sek]

Not sure what its like in your part of the country, but over here in Houston, since there aren't that much rubber guarding going on besides Brian and Cora. Every time Cora tap a kid out with her rubber guard stuff, I can see the facial expression of the kid's coaches as " its ok she just caught you in a gimmick technique" sort of look. They discount it as not a real submission or tap out even though she goes on to do it over and over and over again. Still get the same look.

[Brian Tupper]

When at other gyms...I hear it referred to as 10th planet crap or fancy stuff. I had a guy tell me once that if you're good enough to catch someone with that "fancy stuff", you probably could have caught them with fundamental (I'm assuming he meant traditional) stuff. All I know is that I can go to a gym that focuses on the gi, and I can straight put it on some dudes from twister side. However, since I'm not in the gi very often, they can straight put some collar chokes and sweeps on me. At the end of the day...none of it is cheap or bullshit...it's all what your used to.

[Tori Applegate]

You gotta get past that phase. It's all ego. If its there, tap. It all counts..wrist locks, Ezekiels, heck..if my knee twists funny I'm tapping. Whatever, just don't get caught in it or tap. I've had stuff hyper extended in competition bc I waited to tap. Stupid. Get over the ego, tap, slap hands and go again.

[Matt Young]

Weidman tried a "cheap" Ezekiel. lol

[Sean Marshall]

Weidman tried a "cheap" Ezekiel. lol

lol. Thought he was doing that neck crank that just you a sore neck, noticed the Ezekiel and thought about this thread

[Justin W.]

If anyone taps and has something to say besides "nice one" or "please show me how you did that" it's just ego, so don't even sweat it. That being said, I do believe there are "gimmick" moves and I always defined them in my head as moves that don't really fit/flow into your normal game and aren't widely used or explored to greater lengths yet like the fundamentals. I think once gimmick moves get explored/used more, they can become fundamentals. There's nothing wrong with "gimmick" moves, in fact I find them essential. It's that move you go for when all else fails, it's the move you go to when you wanna make your opponent think twice and create doubt, it's the seasoning on your game that gives it a unique flavor. I think what your training partners/instructor gets annoyed about is when you're training step 7 and you haven't mastered step 1,2,3,4,5,6 yet that will get you to step 7. It's like in poker, you need to first establish a playing style and once they feel like they're reading your moves, BAM! YOU PUNCH THEM IN THE FACE! or bluff or like use a gimmick move because you got them to play inside the box and you like stepped outside and cheated because this is life and we play for keepz.

[David Rosado]

If they're good enough for guys like Erik Paulson and Gene LeBell, they're good enough for me. I notice guys only get mad because they don't know what hit them and they're upset that they had no defense for it. But that's their problem.

I've gotten caught in two mounted no gi Ezekiel's and figured out how to avoid it. Sarkis used to catch me in lots of unorthodox subs. I'd just laugh because, damn, he's an encyclopedia of subs, and I'd feel dumb for getting caught in it. But the jokes on me, you know? I've been on both sides of the coin and my belief is that a sub is a sub. If you get caught, you get caught. Don't like it? Learn to defend it. Ask the guy how he did it.

Writing it off as a gimmick move because you don't like it is hindering your growth. Like for years BJJ guys considered leg locks cheap. From what I've read crowds would even boo if you won by leg lock. Calling leg locks cheap is just sour grapes dating back to Fadda. Crying about neck cranks and wrist locks and pain compliance moves is just sour grapes. That's my take.