"Military" systems vs MMA?

[Enrique "Kiko"]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5C8Gr...eature=related
This is typical of the kind of training they do. I would never in a million years train my students like that.

Wait, are you saying that street assailants don't usually go GYAHHHHH or HEYYYY to verbally telegraph their attack? Or simply take turns during a mass attack? Isn't that unsportsmanlike? =D

[Chris Odell (Datsusara)]

....Besides, military guys have to know how to operate firearms, operate various machinery/vehicles, survive in the wilderness, scale walls, parachute, first aid, communications, etc. MMA guys just fight, that's it....

i for one would love to learn some of these things, especially extensive first aid. anyone here have background in this? i keep wondering how cut doctors learn their art even. if someone in LA has some knowledge perhaps we could have a little advanced first aid class of sorts.

[Brent Alvarez]

First off, I didn't take the time to read each and every post. So if i say something that has been said, plz forgive me. I trained 3 years in Krav Maga b4 making my MMA debut. I only train MMA now, however when i'm done i will go back and get my Black Belt in Krav. Maybe some schools in Krav have drills where plp take turns attacking. That may be the case for lower lvl students. As you progress though. Its a real life fight with multipile attackers.
Just because you beat someone in the cage or ring, doesn't mean you will be them on the streets. I would pick Krav over a MMA fighter in a street fight. They don't waste any energy or time on shit that will stall or put you in a bad position. Once they attack or counter attack, they don't stop until its over with them going home. MMA fighers train with rules and so their mindset is not the same as a Karv students. Yes, they could use illegal stuff now, but seriously, you only remember 25% of what you really know in stressful situations. Which means they will fall back on what they drill most often. I'm not saying a MMA figher couldn't win, only that 9/10 times i believe the person trained to go home with no rules will win. Krav Maga > MMA in a street fight.

[AJ Camacho]

Yes, they could use illegal stuff now, but seriously, you only remember 25% of what you really know in stressful situations. Which means they will fall back on what they drill most often. I'm not saying a MMA figher couldn't win, only that 9/10 times i believe the person trained to go home with no rules will win. Krav Maga > MMA in a street fight.

When you are in a fight and someone bites you while you have mount, you quickly remember that you can bite them. So while they bite your body, you crossface and eat their face off. Most things do not break the fundamental rules of position.

It happens in MMA all of the time. Nick Diaz boxes against his opponent, he gets kicked on his thigh, and then he fires a head kick in retaliation because he just remembered that he can kick people.

Like I said, I am not familiar with Krav Maga, but from the clips I have seen they don't even begin to approach the fundamentals of footwork and/or positioning. I'm sure I am wrong, in some ways, but I would just like to see an example of how they teach and account for positional rules.

[Lindsey Loewen]

I still dont buy this. Energy efficiency in all martial arts comes from technique(JJ, judo, boxing, MT), and my experience in KM was one of many, abbreviated moves with more emphasis on speed and explosiveness, not technique. I found it an amazing workout but I wouldnt not label this in any way energy efficient. Also "street fight with multiple attackers" is very near the same myth that "the government is coming to take our guns", there is such a little chance of this ever happening to the average civilian in America. And if it does, what extreme enviroment or situation did you let yourself get into to get attacked by multiple armed ninjas? Getting punched in the nuts, bitten or an attempted eye gouge doesnt equal getting knocked out or submitted at all. People can fight through dirty fighting techniques and even things like wrist locks provided they have enough rage and adrenaline, in my opinion its a flawed philosophy to rely on them.

[Lindsey Loewen]

First off, I didn't take the time to read each and every post. So if i say something that has been said, plz forgive me. I trained 3 years in Krav Maga b4 making my MMA debut. I only train MMA now, however when i'm done i will go back and get my Black Belt in Krav. Maybe some schools in Krav have drills where plp take turns attacking. That may be the case for lower lvl students. As you progress though. Its a real life fight with multipile attackers.
Just because you beat someone in the cage or ring, doesn't mean you will be them on the streets. I would pick Krav over a MMA fighter in a street fight. They don't waste any energy or time on shit that will stall or put you in a bad position. Once they attack or counter attack, they don't stop until its over with them going home. MMA fighers train with rules and so their mindset is not the same as a Karv students. Yes, they could use illegal stuff now, but seriously, you only remember 25% of what you really know in stressful situations. Which means they will fall back on what they drill most often. I'm not saying a MMA figher couldn't win, only that 9/10 times i believe the person trained to go home with no rules will win. Krav Maga > MMA in a street fight.

I do agree that people will only do what they have been trained to in a real fight, because they are ultraviolent and chaotic and super unpredictable. But this in my opinion is further detrimental to KM because no one can execute groin strikes, wrist breaks or striking to the proficiency MMA practicioners can execute strikes/takedowns/submissions or even standing up in base. As far as real fighting in the STREETZ, hopefully most martial art practicioners can recognize when they are in legitimate danger, no one in their right mind is going to react to a mugging like a 5-round title fight or Grapplers Quest match. You do any techniques that are applicable to get you away from danger and then RUN. I think this is a very valuable lesson from KM but doesnt mean you have to train KM to survive even in the worst situation. Also, KM will be UNAPPLICABLE in the most common situations, as brought up earlier.

[Jason_C]

The problem with Krav is the way they train. Here's an example. They have one guy stand in the middle, while let's say 10 other guys surround him. They attack him one by one, each guy takes a turn to mock attack and let the guy in the middle mock knee him in the nuts several times. What does this accomplish besides giving you a false sense that you can take on multiple attackers?

the point of this drill isn't make someone think they can take on 12 dudes at once, it is designed to make them able to react to an attack coming from any direction and respond accordingly. KM is designed for survival, not so much as a style of attacking.

I'm not trying to defend KM, I'll admit that i believe in an organized event or even a street fight where no one else got involved that the JJ guy wins because like kevin said, military martial arts programs are simply a combination of other forms of martial arts that a bunch of officers decide would be effective in combat.

[AndyK5]

First of all a starcraft player will always own a WOW player. Now as far as krav maga there are advantages such as a regular joe or jane of the street with no prior training can pick up some krav maga and defend themselves in a very short period of time. I am not sure how effective that would be, only that completing the lower levels of krav maga training does not require the commitment that mma and Jiujitsu does. On the other hand, the only way a Krav Magae practitioner to beat an equally trained mma/jiujitsu fighter is in the ring, with a referee applying all the mma rules to the mma fighter, letting the Krav Maga guy to do whatever he pleases. If you put them both on the same footing where they are both defending their lives, than mma/jijitsu guy would triumph. You could reason by saying that mma/jiujitsu is a much more complicated, deeply researched, improved and practiced art where it is a complete fighting arsenal on the other hand Krav Maga is more of a specialized self defense technique, mostly for women or men who like to grab other guys balls
Don't get upset if you are a man and love your Krav Maga, it was just a joke

[Louis Ho]

I'm debating whether to start training Krav Maga or the Gracie Bullyproof Program.

[JoeO'Laughlin]

ive trained with several members of the military in almost every branch , a few rangers , marines, and even a s.e.r.e instructor . and they do seem to lack the martial arts that a mma fighter possess . they are trained to kill with a weapon very handliy , but when it comes to are basic service men and women I actually wonder what they are shown in there B A C classes . theres jits experience lacks the techique . Just wish they spent more. time it is theres lifes they are learning to defend .